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"A lot of bottle collectors have gone underground"

 
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"A lot of bottle collectors have gone underground&... - 11/21/2007 7:59:52 AM   
subsoil


Posts: 97
Joined: 7/31/2006
From: NH
Status: offline 		http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2004025049_webbottle20m.html
Post #: 1
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 8:08:36 AM   
cowseatmaize


Posts: 2135
Joined: 12/2/2004
From: Metro West, MA
Status: offline
quote:

"People need to be sensitive," he said. "Once you move a bottle, once you move an arrowhead, the historical significance is reduced."


The historical significance is greater when it's not known about? Duh, aaah, what?




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If you love what your doing it might be illegal, so watch your back.

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RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 8:25:59 AM   
bearswede


Posts: 2909
Joined: 9/28/2004
From: western mass
Status: offline 		http://science.jrank.org/pages/6540/Stratigraphy-Archeology.html

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RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 9:05:59 AM   
cowseatmaize


Posts: 2135
Joined: 12/2/2004
From: Metro West, MA
Status: offline 		Thanks Ron, informative and it has it's place but... Blah blah.
We're talking Shi%^ers. Dating the age of the shi% doesn't date a bottle. What about that pontil that got tossed in for fill at the top in the teens or the 1860 penny that dropped down into a 1880 privy after it's dug.. Those rules just don't apply here.
If I were to find an ancient artifact I'd want to tell the right people, whoever they may be.
...but 75 years, oh noo, Mr Bill! Pick up that 1930 soda off the side of the road and go directly to jail?



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If you love what your doing it might be illegal, so watch your back.

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Post #: 4
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 9:36:23 AM   
tigue710


Posts: 1716
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: connecticut
Status: offline 		Getting a lot grief for going on that show I see...  I dont know one way or an other if it was more good or more bad for the hobby but you wouldn't of caught me dead on that show!

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aint no bottles in there....

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RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 9:49:35 AM   
bearswede


Posts: 2909
Joined: 9/28/2004
From: western mass
Status: offline 		Archaeological stratigraphy Main article: Archaeological stratigraphy In the field of archaeology, soil stratigraphy is used to better understand the processes that form and protect archaeological sites. The law of superposition holds true, and this can help date finds or features from each context, as they can be placed in sequence and the dates interpolated. Phases of activity can also often be seen through stratigraphy, especially when a trench or feature is viewed in section (profile). As pits and other features can be dug down into earlier levels, not all material at the same absolute depth is necessarily of the same age, but close attention has to be paid to the archeological layers. The Harris-matrix is a tool to depict complex stratigraphic relations, as they are found, for example, in the contexts of urban archaeology. [edit] See also

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RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 10:15:10 AM   
lobeycat


Posts: 3768
Joined: 9/8/2003
From: RED SOX Nation
Status: online 		That's the trouble with this motherF'ing country...you never own anything outright! You work all your life to buy a **** piece of land and plop a nice respectable hovel down on it, pay state, federal, and local taxes till you **** eyes bleed and still you own nothing! Any home owners out there? Got yourself a nice piece of property do you? $18536.73 worth of landscaping has it? Staying ahead of the painting to keep it looking respectable will ya? You don't own dick! You rent it from the state bucko! Your a piss poor share cropper and your crops are cutting the grass and raking ther leaves. An indentured servant to the state, without a glimmer of hope of ever working your way out of bondage! Think I'm wrong? Stop paying your land taxes for a few years, say ten or so. You'll be evicted like a homeless man at a Donald Trump tea party...and there's not a god blessed thing you can do about it.
Can't dig for artifacts on my own property? Bullshit! If I pushed my spade through the forehead of Thoman Jefferson himself, I'd pull his molding ass out of the hole, prop him up on my sofa, stick american flags in his eye sockets and charge $20 admission to the public. Tell me I wouldn't!

Lobey!

(in reply to tigue710)
Post #: 7
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 10:38:50 AM   
citydigger

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline 		The government will not be happy until they turn the US into an ABSOLUTE socialist country. they want to control everything. But you see, they can't be everywhere. hahahahahahaha! Just keep a low profile and dig on!

< Message edited by citydigger -- 11/21/2007 10:49:47 AM >

(in reply to subsoil)
Post #: 8
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 10:39:29 AM   
Humabdos

 

Posts: 446
Joined: 6/13/2004
From: Greenville Texas The Blackest land whitest people
Status: offline 		This really sucks!  Let's see now the stuff my dad threw out in the back yard 75 years ago now belongs to the state?  F$%# that!  Our governor lets in 100,000 illegal aliens to ruin our state now they want to stop us from digging up our history? Do you think the Mexicans give a shat about our history? They( the mayor of Portland) have already started re-naming our streets after Mexicans! 
What the State of Oregon should be focused on is ridding our state of Illegal aliens who are destroying the quality of life here with their gangs, drugs and violence not to mention the burden they place on social services with their excessive breeding habits.


As Dale said "most Oregon diggers are going under ground".... pun intended

The digging will continue...   Their is no law saying you can't clean out your privy or remove trash from your land that would be very unhealthy besides ridiculous! 

< Message edited by Humabdos -- 11/21/2007 3:20:48 PM >

(in reply to lobeycat)
Post #: 9
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 10:42:48 AM   
bearswede


Posts: 2909
Joined: 9/28/2004
From: western mass
Status: offline
quote:

Tell me I wouldn't!


Not without suffering some consequences, Lobes... Oh, wait... This is Adams' Country... Maybe for that particular stiff, you might be OK...


R(ool) (Rhymes with "drool")


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RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 11:05:09 AM   
citydigger

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline 		Land of the free my but! I am glad you all feel the same way I do. They complain about an honest, hardworking person having a hobby so he can enjoy himself and maybe get away from all the crap in the world. Now they want to regulate digging for old trash? Thats what it all is guys, TRASH. Instead of focusing on stopping the real criminals, like robbers, ILLEGAL ALIENS, drug traficers,  etc... they spend their time harrassing the honest HARD WORKING MAN. Thats where they can make the most money in fines. They dog the middle class because they rely on the rich for their campaign contributions (corruption), and try to help the poor and ILLEGALS so they can look good while weeding out the middle class. It is the middle class american they gaff. This is the USA of today! LAND OF THE FREE FOR ILLEGALS AND CRIMINALS! HOME OF THE RICH! It is disgusting!

< Message edited by citydigger -- 11/21/2007 11:17:36 AM >

(in reply to bearswede)
Post #: 11
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 11:13:07 AM   
Humabdos

 

Posts: 446
Joined: 6/13/2004
From: Greenville Texas The Blackest land whitest people
Status: offline 		Very well said Citydigger!
Archaeological sites: What the Oregon law says:

A person may not knowingly and intentionally excavate, injure, destroy or alter an archaeological site or object on public or private lands without first obtaining an archaeological permit, according to a series of state laws. The one pertaining to private lands is Oregon Administrative Rule 736-051-0090. On private or public non-federal lands, an official archaeological site is defined when it has 10 or more artifacts that are 75 years or older located in a concentrated geographic area, said Susan Lynn White, Oregon assistant state archaeologist. Violation of these laws is a Class B misdemeanor punishable by up to six months in jail, White said.
“Removal of human remains is a Class C Felony,” she adds. “The state police can be contacted and the site shut down.”
Oregon law also prohibits a person from selling, purchasing, trading, bartering or exchanging an artifact that has been removed from an archaeological site on public, non-federal land or obtained from private land without the written permission of the landowner, White said.

For more information, contact White at 503-986-0675 or e-mail Susan.White@state.or.us.
Reach reporter Sanne Specht at 541-776-4497 or e-mail sspecht@mailtribune.com.Please call and E-mail Susan and let her know what you think about this.

< Message edited by Humabdos -- 11/21/2007 11:19:20 AM >

(in reply to citydigger)
Post #: 12
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 11:17:16 AM   
lobeycat


Posts: 3768
Joined: 9/8/2003
From: RED SOX Nation
Status: online 		Happy Thanksgiving Swedeman!
 

(in reply to bearswede)
Post #: 13
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 11:23:51 AM   
citydigger

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline 		they say it is illegal. they complain about the items we excavate from OLD TRASH DUMPS and say when the items are taken from the ground they loose their context (meaning). Obviously they had no meaning or they would not have been thrown into a DUMP! What context? It was all trash that people threw away? This is just the government flexing its SOCIALIST muscle. Nothing more. Makes me SICK!

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Post #: 14
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 11:34:32 AM   
citydigger

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tigue710

Getting a lot grief for going on that show I see...  I dont know one way or an other if it was more good or more bad for the hobby but you wouldn't of caught me dead on that show!


Me niether, your just asking for the WRONG kind of attention when you do stuff like that. All the best diggers I know keep a low profile

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Post #: 15
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 12:20:48 PM   
GuntherHess


Posts: 5111
Joined: 12/13/2004
From: Frederick Maryland
Status: online 		Keep in mind we are talking about Oregon here, which has about as much in common with other USA states as Sweden or Lichtenstein
I expect they enacted the laws to protect American Aboriginal sites, which needs to be done , but they did it in a typically wishy-washy Oregonese government way. Hey , they may not of even realized there were European Americans in Oregon earlier than 75 years ago
You cant take that law toooooo seriously, apparently they dont.

Anyone that goes on national tv and divulges ANYTHING they do privately is just asking for trouble, isnt that fairly obvious?

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Post #: 16
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 12:28:09 PM   
bearswede


Posts: 2909
Joined: 9/28/2004
From: western mass
Status: offline
quote:

This is just the government flexing its SOCIALIST muscle. Nothing more.


Is this a joke? Must be...


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Post #: 17
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 12:32:12 PM   
bearswede


Posts: 2909
Joined: 9/28/2004
From: western mass
Status: offline
quote:

Obviously they had no meaning or they would not have been thrown into a DUMP! What context? It was all trash that people threw away?


Most of the material culture that archeology deals with is "trash that people threw away"... Shell middens, tells, refuse pits, hearths... It's all the nitty gritty of archeolgy, for God's sake!


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Post #: 18
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 12:33:20 PM   
citydigger

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GuntherHess

Keep in mind we are talking about Oregon here, which has about as much in common with other USA states as Sweden or Lichtenstein
I expect they enacted the laws to protect American Aboriginal sites, which needs to be done , but they did it in a typically wishy-washy Oregonese government way. Hey , they may not of even realized there were European Americans in Oregon earlier than 75 years ago
You cant take that law toooooo seriously, apparently they dont.

Anyone that goes on national tv and divulges ANYTHING they do privately is just asking for trouble, isnt that fairly obvious?


I will have to agree with you GuntherHess, especially about the going on TV part. We cannot go on TV and brag about what we do. It just gives these government SOCIALIST nuts the ammunition they need to make a stink. We need to understand, most of these government funded archaes have nothing better to do. Most of them just sit around thinking of ways to sound more intellegent. It takes them 10 years to do what us treasure hunters to in one day. I think the point is:
IF YOU BLATANTLY CALL ATTENTION TO YOURSELF, THIS IS WHAT WILL HAPPEN.
It is one thing to get caught by the cops while out digging for bottles/artifacts. Most of them, at the worst, will kick you out, thats it. But when you go on PUBLIC TV and announce what you are doing, your fate is inevitable.

(in reply to GuntherHess)
Post #: 19
RE: "A lot of bottle collectors have gone undergro... - 11/21/2007 12:42:33 PM   
citydigger

 

Posts: 81
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bearswede

quote:

Obviously they had no meaning or they would not have been thrown into a DUMP! What context? It was all trash that people threw away?


Most of the material culture that archeology deals with is "trash that people threw away"... Shell middens, tells, refuse pits, hearths... It's all the nitty gritty of archeolgy, for God's sake!



You are correct. but when the trash is taken to a massive dumpsite and tossed in, there cannot be any context associated with it since it was taken from it's place of origin and brought to a separate site in which it was disposed of. The best archaeologists try and focus on a site with historical relevance where the items found can be linked to that specific site. An example of what I am saying would be an old cellar hole. The cellar hole can be linked to who lived in that place. If the person who lived in that house took their trash to a town dump outside their residence, there is no context. Is there?

(in reply to bearswede)
Post #: 20
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