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Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade?

 
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Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/21/2010 5:45:04 PM   
passthebottle

 

Posts: 473
Joined: 1/23/2007
Status: online 		That is something that I always wondered about. I have a number of sun colored bottles packed away in boxes and it seems to me that when I look at them from time to time they seem to be losing some of their color. Does the color fade over time if the bottles are not left in the sun ?
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RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/21/2010 6:09:10 PM   
GuntherHess


Posts: 11468
Joined: 12/13/2004
From: Frederick Maryland
Status: offline 		dont think so.

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RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/21/2010 6:23:30 PM   
cyberdigger


Posts: 11900
Joined: 11/29/2008
From: I 195 @ US 9, NJ USA
Status: online 		Exposing them to moonlight takes the purple out.. or so I've heard..

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Post #: 3
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/21/2010 11:04:27 PM   
RED Matthews


Posts: 2268
Joined: 8/2/2008
Status: offline 		Hello all of you.  I first ran into SCA   Sun Colored Amethyst, on a trip to California.  Out west I would see bottles laying on wood shed roofs.  When I asked about this practice, I was told about the action of the sun.  I looked it up and learned why this happened.  I have several fly traps that are SCA and last winter I hung a nice clear glass fish net float on the front porch and it colored up great.  I will only happen on clear glass that was made before about 1913 and is the result of manganese in the glass batch.  The 1st World War turned off this element for use in the glass batch.  When used it was to improve clear glass control and to help in the molten metal forming ease.  RED Matthews  


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RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/22/2010 8:16:01 AM   
Jody35150

 

Posts: 115
Joined: 2/13/2010
From: Sylacauga, Alabama
Status: offline 		You know how you 'hear' things... I had always heard that if you heated a bottle with the purple tint, it would return to its' original clarity.

I tried it on a whiskey bottle which had been irradiated; it was the dark unattractive purple.

Left it in the oven at 300 degrees for a while, and forgot it was in there. Re-heated the oven to 400 later, only remembering the bottle when the preheat indicator sounded.

In the end there was no change in the degree of tint.

The naturally sun-colored glass, as described by RED Matthew, is in my opinion the most beautiful.



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RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/22/2010 4:28:59 PM   
RedGinger


Posts: 6542
Joined: 12/7/2007
Status: offline 		I wouldn't think they would fade.  It's not like a sun tan.  It's a chemical reaction in the glass.  It's kind of cool because it can help date a bottle.  Some people really like that amethyst color.  I think the lightest hint of it is pretty if I find an old bottle like that.  I wouldn't sit it in the sun to develop that color, though.  That's just my personal preference.  Some people like to sit them under lights to make them a darker purple. 

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RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/23/2010 12:12:36 PM   
JOETHECROW


Posts: 9282
Joined: 9/3/2005
From: Northwestern Pa. (Near scenic Lake Perfidy)
Status: online 		Here's the only info I'd run across pertaining to reversal of sun coloring...

Thermal Reversals of Authentic Colors (Reversing Sun-Purpled Insulators):

It is an established certainty that most, if not all, light to medium purple California embossed insulators emerged from their factory molds in shades of off-clear, yellow, smoky yellow or light yellow green; and the darker purple/deep burgundy examples were most likely golden yellow. Light to medium purple WGM insulators were originally clear, off-clear, straw or light yellow green. Since we’ve already learned that manganese-bearing glass will react to the ultra-violet rays of the sun, we now know how and why the preceding examples were naturally transformed to varying shades of purple. We will now investigate a practice that has been performed by some unscrupulous individuals to reverse this natural purpling process, in some instances for monetary gain due to the rarer and more valuable resultant colors.  

Exposure to high levels of heat will reverse the sun’s ultra-violet purpling effects on glass. This procedure is often referred to by collectors as “cooking”. During the thermal reversal or “cooking” process, the manganese is once again the key stimulant. In most cases, when a sun “purpled” insulator is heated to high temperatures, generally a step below melting, it will revert back to a shade in close proximity to its original manufactured color.   By Reintroducing a "cooked" insulator to direct sunlight the natural purpling process will begin to occur once again, although the resultant color tones may differ from the original.  Be aware that deliberate partial exposures can create artificial two-tones as well.

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Post #: 7
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/31/2010 1:33:01 PM   
ktbi


Posts: 931
Joined: 6/7/2007
From: Vacaville, Ca.
Status: offline 		If I set a clear glass bottle out in the sun, how long does it take for the purple to start showing?
Thnks.....Ron


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Post #: 8
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 8/31/2010 2:08:54 PM   
blobbottlebob


Posts: 3356
Joined: 12/20/2005
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		Hey Ron,
My guess is a very long time. The bottles that I find in amethyst have been in the water for 100 years (and they aren't that dark). I leave a few in the windows in the hope that they are darkening. Maybe someone could do an experiment? Take two bottles, identical in coloration and put one out while the other stays boxed. Might be interesting???

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Post #: 9
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 9/5/2010 12:57:35 PM   
Plumbata


Posts: 1535
Joined: 12/4/2007
Status: offline 		Dunno about the fading part, but the latest SCA bottle I've seen was a TMFG CO milk with what I imagine was the date of 1916 on the base (a 16). Perhaps a late holdout made with the remnants of old manganese stockpiles?

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Post #: 10
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 9/5/2010 5:21:08 PM   
GuntherHess


Posts: 11468
Joined: 12/13/2004
From: Frederick Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

Exposure to high levels of heat will reverse the sun’s ultra-violet purpling effects on glass. This procedure is often referred to by collectors as “cooking”. During the thermal reversal or “cooking” process, the manganese is once again the key stimulant. In most cases, when a sun “purpled” insulator is heated to high temperatures, generally a step below melting, it will revert back to a shade in close proximity to its original manufactured color. By Reintroducing a "cooked" insulator to direct sunlight the natural purpling process will begin to occur once again, although the resultant color tones may differ from the original. Be aware that deliberate partial exposures can create artificial two-tones as well.


I know you cant do it in a conventional oven. Thats already been tried.
I havent done an experiment in a glass kiln (we do have one here).
Problem is the insulator (or bottle) turns into a puddle if you get it too hot.
Also the cooling cycle can be tricky and the glass often cracks.
I may do an experiment to verify this.

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Post #: 11
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 9/5/2010 5:31:47 PM   
cyberdigger


Posts: 11900
Joined: 11/29/2008
From: I 195 @ US 9, NJ USA
Status: online 		Cool! make another one of those candy dishes!!

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Post #: 12
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 9/5/2010 5:44:39 PM   
cyberdigger


Posts: 11900
Joined: 11/29/2008
From: I 195 @ US 9, NJ USA
Status: online




Attachment (1)

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Post #: 13
RE: Do Sun Colored Bottles Fade? - 9/5/2010 6:12:21 PM   
GuntherHess


Posts: 11468
Joined: 12/13/2004
From: Frederick Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

make another one of those candy dishes!!

That was my wife's strange experiment.

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Web Site - http://antiquemedicines.com

Email : mknapp@antiquemedicines.com

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Post #: 14
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