LockedEARLIEST OWENS-ILLINOIS SODA BOTTLE MARK (NON-ACL)

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SODAPOPBOB
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RE: EARLIEST OWENS-ILLINOIS SODA BOTTLE MARK (NON-ACL) 2011/10/16 23:55:32 (permalink)
Celery ~
 
Thanks for the info. Especially about the Kolatona bottle. That will chalk up one for sure 1931 Owens-Illinois bottle. According to the chart I keep referring to, the Evansville, Indiana plant number 11 closed in 1939. So if the chart is correct as I believe it is, then there is no way the 1 on your Kolatona bottle could be for 1941. Any chance of seeing a picture of the base? You know, just for the official record?   
 
Thanks a lot.
 
Bob
 
P.S. ~ My apologies to Alice Creswick for assumming she was a guy.
 
Hey madman! Where's your pictures?  (Lol)

madman
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RE: EARLIEST OWENS-ILLINOIS SODA BOTTLE MARK (NON-ACL) 2011/10/17 00:34:42 (permalink)
yup!

always looking for, Toledo Ohio, Knoxville Tn. milks pharms and sodas,
celerycola
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RE: EARLIEST OWENS-ILLINOIS SODA BOTTLE MARK (NON-ACL) 2011/10/17 16:24:06 (permalink)
Heres a series of Illinois Glass bottles from 1926 to 1931, all from the Kolatona Bottling Works of Huntington IN. Kolatona was a Celery and Kola drink that originated in Huntington in 1894 and was sold in bottle types from 1890's blob top to 1950's acls. The earlier Kolatona bottles I have from Huntington are a couple of amber blobs and a bimal circa 1910 crown with similar embossing to these and no contents (pre-dating the Gould Amendment) and no manufacturer marks. I have not seen a bottle for this brand dating between 1914 and 1926. I have acls dating 1946 (Ball), 1954 (unknown mark), and 1955 (Duraglas) but have not seen a bottle dating between 1931 and 1946.




Five bottles I'll number 1 thru 5 left to right.



#1) bottom has the number 1 and the diamond <I>.
Heel has 1040 26



#2) no diamond <I> anywhere. Heel has 1040 26X (what's the X mean?)



#3) bottom has the number 1 and the diamond <I>.
Heel has 1040 with no year



#4) bottom has 30 S for IG Streator IL 1930. no diamond <I> or <(I)>



#5) bottom has 11 <(I)> 1 so 1931

SODAPOPBOB
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RE: EARLIEST OWENS-ILLINOIS SODA BOTTLE MARK (NON-ACL) 2011/10/17 18:43:38 (permalink)
Celery ~
 
Bingo! Bango!
 
I'm listing the last one #5 as an offical 1931 Owens-Illinois soda bottle. Plant #11 Evansville, Indiana ~ which closed in 1939 ~ confirms that the 1 represents 1931.
 
Good job!
 
Thank you very much.
 
Bob
 
P.S. ~  I contacted the Chamber of Commerce in Fremont, Nebraska to see if they can tell me when the Coca Cola Bottling Company began and ceased operation there. Knowing this should help me to more accurately date my "Quality" bottle.
 
[ Quality Base ] 
celerycola
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Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/18 18:33:57 (permalink)
I went thru my Green Deco Sodas and found these three bottles dated 1929 - 1930 - 1931.



Left to Right #1 #2 #3.




#1) Big Boy Charlotte NC
29N for Newark OH plant of Illinois Glass




#2) Broadway Dry New York NY
BOTH <(I)> for Owens/Illinois and 30S for Illinois Glass Streator Plant




#3) Brand Houston TX
9 <(I)> 1 for Owens-Illinois 1931

madman
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 00:11:49 (permalink)
thanks for clearing up the s and n i posted that way back in this thing but wasnt sure what bottle maker mark that was! end game!

always looking for, Toledo Ohio, Knoxville Tn. milks pharms and sodas,
SODAPOPBOB
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 04:48:14 (permalink)
Celery ~

Your bottles display what I consider to be a rarely seen transition from Owens and Illinois sererately, to them together. The Broadway bottle is especially interesting and unique because it has both marks. Based on what I see, I suspect all of the 1930s bottles are likely the same, as no doubt are the 1929s. In a way, I'd say this establishes soda bottle history and answers the question as to what the earliest Owens-Illinois bottles and their marks look like. I bet there aren't too many collectors who have ever seen one. It's certainly my first.

As far as I'm concerned this mystery is solved. And where there is one bottle there are certainly more. But one is enough for the record.

Once again you have proved your resources invaluable.

Thanks a million.

Bob     
post edited by SODAPOPBOB - 2011/10/19 04:52:04
celerycola
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 07:03:31 (permalink)
I seriously doubt you will see a 1929 <(I)>. I suspect by the time the lawyers completed the details of the merger all of the plants were up and in production for the season. Retooling molds to apply a new logo would have cost time and money in lost production.

The 1930 transition bottle with both 30S and <(I)> indicates the new company was still figuring out the details following the merger. I like that this transition bottle is a New York City bottle appearing just months after the October 1929 stock market crash that launched the Great Depression. Due to the economic uncertainty and bank failures a lot of bottlers nationwide may have been hesitant if financially unable to purchase new bottles in 1930. It would be interesting to see sales and production figures for both the Owens and Illinois companies and the combined business for 1929 through 1931. There may not have been that many 1930-31 bottles made.
SODAPOPBOB
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 12:46:48 (permalink)
Celery ~
 
Well said, and I agree 100%. About a week ago I sent an e-mail to the current O-I Company, asking if they had a department or individual who could answer a few questions I had. They replied saying they did not have a public relations department for such inquiries. So it sounds like their records are sealed and we may never know everything that ocurred in the early days. However, I believe someone wrote a book about the Owens-Illinois history. I can't recall at the moment where I saw a reference to that book, but I'm pretty sure one exist.
 
Thanks again.
 
Bob 
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 13:26:14 (permalink)
              I just did some quick research and found the book I was thinking of. It is titled ...

                        The Glassmakers, Revisited: A History of Owens-Illinois, Inc.

                                                                 By

                                                         Jack K Paquette 

Here's a link. If it connects properly it will give a sample of the contents. The downloadable Kindle version is available for $7.95. And Amazon.com copies starting at $29.95.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/B003N2QZJW/ref=sib_dp_kd#reader-link

Short Desription

"Its corporate name is hardly a household word, yet Owens-Illinois, Inc., located near a small town in northwestern Ohio, is the world’s largest manufacturer of the glass bottles and jars used to provide food, beverages and medicines every day to millions of people around the globe.

Unlike most corporate histories, The Glassmakers, Revisited, is a page turner....a book filled with illuminating facts and interesting anecdotes about the company that became a global giant due to the mechanical genius of Michael J. Owens, who, in 1903, invented a machine to blow bottles, automatically, and Edward D. Libbey, the astute glassmaker who bankrolled him.
 

post edited by SODAPOPBOB - 2011/10/19 13:27:07

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SODAPOPBOB
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 13:49:42 (permalink)
I just purchased this book on e-bay. I'm not sure yet exactly what all it contains, but hopefully it will prove interesting. It is an original copy dated 1931.



                                     Want Book & Price List Owens-Illinois Glass Co. 1931
 
Link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Want-Book-Price-List-Owens-Illinois-Glass-Co-1931-/350498430029?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item519b559c4d I will let you know what the book is about when I receive it in about a week. With shipping the total came to $13.95. SPB 

post edited by SODAPOPBOB - 2011/10/19 13:54:10
SODAPOPBOB
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 14:21:12 (permalink)
P.S. ~
 
I also just purchased a new paperback version of the Owens-Illinois book from Amazon.com for a total of $19.94. So with these two books on the way, I should be an Owens-Illinois expert real soon. (Lol). I hope!
 
I'll report back later.
 
Bob 
madman
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 14:53:43 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: SODAPOPBOB

I just purchased this book on e-bay. I'm not sure yet exactly what all it contains, but hopefully it will prove interesting. It is an original copy dated 1931.



                                    Want Book & Price List Owens-Illinois Glass Co. 1931
 
Link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Want-Book-Price-List-Owens-Illinois-Glass-Co-1931-/350498430029?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item519b559c4d I will let you know what the book is about when I receive it in about a week. With shipping the total came to $13.95. SPB 


wow thats the ticket it will show all the bottles for that year nice find bob!

always looking for, Toledo Ohio, Knoxville Tn. milks pharms and sodas,
SODAPOPBOB
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 16:21:32 (permalink)
madman ~
 
Thanks. I just spent the past hour researching the Owens-Illinois Want Book/Price List, and it appears to be "extremely rare."  I'm excited and can't wait for it to arrive!
 
In the meantime, check this out. It is a postcard of the Streator, Illinois glass plant. Notice at the top where it says ... "Owens-Illinois"
 
But wait a minute and I will show you something interesting about the post mark on the other side.
 
Bob
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 16:28:03 (permalink)
This postcard is currently available on e-bay, but I do not intend to purchase it. The seller describes it as being dated 1928 ... and it sure looks like 1928 to me. But how can it be dated 1928 when Owens-Illinois didn't merge until 1929? Hmmm ... very interesting. Unless it's actually 1938. ??? I really don't know!
 
What say you?
 
Bob
SODAPOPBOB
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/19 17:13:01 (permalink)
I should have done this earlier, but didn't think of it until just now. I did a couple of zooms on the postcard and discovered it is dated 1938. Plus, in the lower right corner is the card number ...
 
                                                                 8A381
 
Based on everything I know about those old linen postcards, part of the number is also the date it was made.
 
So this all turned out to be much to do about nothing. Sorry bout that. I'm just glad I didn't buy the postcard, which I almost did. Heck, I already spent $35.00 today. But that's okay, because I just increased the estimated value of the Owens-Illinois "Want Book" to $50.00.  
 
SPB  
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/22 12:26:45 (permalink)
I'm still working on trying to determine if my "Quality" bottle from Fremont, Nebraska (Coca Cola Bottling Co.) is a 1931 or 1941. And although I'm surprised I didn't think of this earlier, I just checked Bill Porter's book to see what dates it shows for Fremont. As it turns out, it list the 1923 bottle from Fremont as being rare. And as most of us know, the Coca Cola 1923 patent bottles were made from 1928 thru 1938. So this tells us the Fremont, Nebraska Coca Cola bottler was in business at least as early as 1938, and possibly even sooner. Which means there is still a 'chance' that my "Quality" bottle is from 1931.
 
Note: I sent e-mail inquiries to both the Fremont Chamber of Commerce and the Nebraska Historical Society, asking when the Coca Cola bottler first opened in Fremont, but I have not heard back from either one of them. My next step is to contact Bill Porter and see what year his earliest 1923 hobbleskirt from Fremont, Nebraska is dated. (If he has one ?)  
 
SPBOB      
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/22 14:30:04 (permalink)
While looking through my recently acquired Beverage Blue Book 1930 edition I noticed an ad from Owens-Illinois where they are claiming to have three divisions, and I was wondering if maybe this might help explain the odd differences we have been finding early on. The three are the Illinois, American, and Graham divisions and may be separated due to the glass companies that they bought to form the parent company. If this is the case then there is a distinct possibly that each division would have it's own standards of dating, quality control, etc. held over from their prior incarnations. It may have taken the company several years to sort the differences out into one company standard.

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SODAPOPBOB
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/22 14:49:33 (permalink)
Morb ~
 
The information you posted is great and will be worth researching further. I'm hoping the Owens-Illinois history book I ordered recently, but have not received yet, will cover some of that stuff and more.
 
                                                                     ~ * ~
 
Also ... I just heard back from Bill Porter and he said the Coca Cola bottler in Fremont, Nebraska began operation in 1924. And even though this doesn't confirm my "Quality" bottle as being from 1931, it's starting to look as if it 'could' be.
 
Bill said he got the Fremont date from a book titled, "Bottlers of Coca Cola" By: Bill Rickett. He said the book is out of print now, but is one to look for. I have never heard of it, but plan to do a search for one. Does anyone reading this have a copy of the book? If so, please tell us what you think of it.
 
Thanks.
 
SPBOB       
celerycola
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RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930 2011/10/22 17:13:03 (permalink)
I have Rickett's book here somewhere. It is shirt pocket sized so will be hard to find.

ORIGINAL: SODAPOPBOB

Morb ~

The information you posted is great and will be worth researching further. I'm hoping the Owens-Illinois history book I ordered recently, but have not received yet, will cover some of that stuff and more.

                                                                    ~ * ~

Also ... I just heard back from Bill Porter and he said the Coca Cola bottler in Fremont, Nebraska began operation in 1924. And even though this doesn't confirm my "Quality" bottle as being from 1931, it's starting to look as if it 'could' be.

Bill said he got the Fremont date from a book titled, "Bottlers of Coca Cola" By: Bill Rickett. He said the book is out of print now, but is one to look for. I have never heard of it, but plan to do a search for one. Does anyone reading this have a copy of the book? If so, please tell us what you think of it.

Thanks.

SPBOB       

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