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All Forums >> [Bottle Forums] >> Sodas - Embossed, Paper Label and ACLs. >> Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?"

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Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 7:31:01 PM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline Anyone know the real origins of the term "Pop Bottle?"  Back when I was a kid everyone around here called soda bottles by that term. Due to the immigration of vast numbers of furriners   into this area, the term soda bottle has become the norm & if I say , "pop bottle"...they look at me as if I'm nuts...(and I may be).I was told eons ago, that it was because of the sound a Hutchinson bottle made when you smacked down the wire loop stopper with the hand. But, if ya think about it , that can't be right as the simple removal of a cork will also produce a "pop" sound.Reason I was asking is I ran upon this ad in Bottles, Flasks ,& Dr Dyott , and it illustrated a "porter" bottle going "pop."Being as the ad dates from 1827 , it predates the Hutchinson bottle by quite a few years.Also how did the term "pop bottle" come to be associated with mainly sodas (carbonated drinks) ?Any ideas? < Message edited by whiskeyman -- 9/19/2007 7:36:39 PM > _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com Post #: 1

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 7:32:38 PM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline The 1827 Ad... Attachment (1) _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 2

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 7:33:13 PM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline Close up... Attachment (1) _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 3

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 7:44:49 PM    capsoda Posts: 7869 Joined: 11/15/2005 From: Seminole,Alabama, USA Status: offline I had always heard the Hutchinson story and was more inclined to beleave it. I remember my grand dad telling me that they pushed the wire and the bottle would "pop" and then he would pull the wire, shake the bottle and do it again. I think a cork would only pop once and since kids were probably a major target of soda pop manufactures the name would stick. My grand dad called it pop his whole life. _____________________________ Warren Diggin down in Dixie, USA Work is for people who don't dig bottles President, Panhandle Cruisers http://www.panhandlecruisers.org/ (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 4

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 9:06:30 PM    RICKJJ59W Posts: 3624 Joined: 3/8/2007 From: Lehigh Valley US of A Status: offline If it says (pop)  coming from the cork on  1827  bottle ad,  how can you say it came from the hutch? thay might have not called it pop back then, but thats where Pop came from. Rick _____________________________ My Web Page.Lots of pix. Dig story's published in Antique Bottle & Glass Collector. New story added 9/08 www.19thcenturybottlediggers.com Digs in action. http://www.flickr.com/photos/pitpirate/ (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 5

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 9:46:22 PM    appliedlips Posts: 1681 Joined: 1/30/2005 Status: offline      That is a cool ad but I am with Cap on this one.The bottle in the ad is not a soda or mineral water so it's just referring to the sound of the cork being removed to sell drinks.Similar to the the way they still sell beer."pop a top".Popping open a bottle of Champagne or wine would be another example but doesn't explain why soda is called Pop.The hutch theory makes much more sense to me,anyway.Great thread,Doug (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 6

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 10:19:35 PM    acls   Posts: 305 Joined: 6/2/2005 Status: offline I read about this once, but for the life of me I can't remember where.  I don't know if I read it off a website or in a magazine. If I am recalling this right when soda water was bottled they had a problem with the gas from the carbonation building up inside the bottle.  Eventually the cork couldn't take the presuure and it would "pop" right out of the bottle making a loud "popping" sound.  Because of this people nicknamed Soda water "pop".  If I am remebering this right this was some time around 1860. Eventually they figued out if bottles were transported on their sides where the cork would stay wet the cork would not pop out. Not sure if this is true, but it sounds plausible. < Message edited by acls -- 9/19/2007 10:23:15 PM > (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 7

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/19/2007 10:24:08 PM    tncgal Posts: 255 Joined: 8/10/2005 From: east TN Status: offline Yes, whiskeyman, I have an idea.  :-) Robert Southey, 1777-1843 English poet/author, wrote to his wife {Edith} about pop in July, 1812.  He says "drank some most admirable cyder, a new manufactory of a nectar, between soda-water and ginger-beer, and called pop, because 'pop goes the cork' when it is drawn, and pop you will go off too, if you drank too much of it."   This is from Selections from the Letters of Robert Southey, by Robert Southey, John Wood Warner, published 1856, page 284. _____________________________ ~ tncgal ~ (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 8

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/20/2007 12:29:46 AM    capsoda Posts: 7869 Joined: 11/15/2005 From: Seminole,Alabama, USA Status: offline The word "pop" was supposed to have been coined in 1861 but for the life of me I can't find out by whom it was coined so it makes it wery subjective. I did find out that "pop" was associated with non acoholic carbonated beverges but it seems to have come from a variety of times and places in history. I do know that in the early 1900s it was common because it is referanced in many adds and writings so I'll stick with the hutch theory because I have had first hand referance to that. We all know fad words come and go. Words like cool beans from the 20s and 30s and groovey from the 60s but some words catch on and hang around forever like "pop" and that is cool dudes and dudets. _____________________________ Warren Diggin down in Dixie, USA Work is for people who don't dig bottles President, Panhandle Cruisers http://www.panhandlecruisers.org/ (in reply to tncgal) Post #: 9

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/20/2007 8:18:41 AM    cowseatmaize Posts: 2135 Joined: 12/2/2004 From: Metro West, MA Status: offline Nice find Brenda, a little light reading? Very interesting and the fact he states it's already termed "pop" is cool. The only problem would be the "and pop you will go off too, if you drank too much of it. That gets into alcohol and away from the "associated with non acoholic carbonated beverges" as Warren mentioned. Could it be we have all been wrong since 1861? lol If it wasn't so early I'd "pop" open a beer and ponder that. < Message edited by cowseatmaize -- 9/20/2007 8:22:52 AM > _____________________________ My 10¢ worth (inflation) Eric If you love what your doing it might be illegal, so watch your back. (in reply to capsoda) Post #: 10

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/20/2007 11:23:48 AM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline WTG, TNCGAL... Thanks for the informative input everyone. But don't quit now... After I posted my query, I wondered if Cecil Munsey had covered the term in his book: The Illustrated Guide to Collecting Bottles @ 1970. And indeed he had , giving basically word for word the same info TNCGAL posted. (pg.104)Cecil does note the drink as being ginger ale, a combination of soda waters & ginger beer. He also omitted the : " pop you will go off too,etc."Cecil also stated." It may be true that internal stoppered bottles perpetuated the nickname ( soda pop)." But in an earlier paragraph he notes that the Hutch being responsible for the term is a misconception. Saying that the Hutch is responsible for the term soda pop and pop bottle seems to indicate the terms are very similar/related. As COWZ noted: there are indications of Southey's soda pop being alcoholic - but perhaps Southey meant if you drank too much you urinated more often? Ginger ale was touted as medicinal for ages, even my Mom gave it to me for upset stomach. And it does flush the kidneys. That earlier ginger ale may have been some powerful stuff indeed.Another note: Hutches weren't used solely for soda, but also for mineral water & beer. What's this 1861 date refer to? The Hutchinson stopper wasn't invented until 1879. _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 11

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/20/2007 11:36:06 AM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline Another little tidbit of info in Munsey's book I was unaware of: The soda & mineral water businesses finally became two seperate businesses in about 1838 or 1839 when Eugene Roussel, a Philadelphia perfume dealer, introduced flavors to the soda water he sold at his shop. The idea of flavored soda water, although not **original, caught on quickly this time and gave it the boost  that assured it a permanent place in the American way of life. **was also in Philadelphia in 1807, that Townsend Speakman, who carbonated water for a Dr. Philip Syng Physick, added fruit juices to the water but the idea did not find acceptance and was dropped . < Message edited by whiskeyman -- 9/20/2007 11:39:15 AM > _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 12

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/20/2007 4:23:25 PM    cowseatmaize Posts: 2135 Joined: 12/2/2004 From: Metro West, MA Status: offline Great points Charlie. I wonder if the Pop that Southey referred to was a human kind of cork pull. Either a belch or... well you know. _____________________________ My 10¢ worth (inflation) Eric If you love what your doing it might be illegal, so watch your back. (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 13

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/20/2007 10:59:35 PM    capsoda Posts: 7869 Joined: 11/15/2005 From: Seminole,Alabama, USA Status: offline In the 1770s, scientists made important progress in replicating natural mineral waters. Englishman Joseph Priestley impregnated distilled water with carbon dioxide. Another Englishman, John Mervin Nooth, improved Priestley's design and sold his apparatus for commercial use in pharmacies. Swedish chemist Torbern Bergman invented a generating apparatus that made carbonated water from chalk by the use of sulfuric acid. Bergman's apparatus allowed imitation mineral water to be produced in large. The name "soft drink" specifies a lack of alcohol by way of contrast to the term "hard drink" and the term "drink", the latter of which is nominally neutral but often carries connotations of alcoholic content. The  term "pop" was first coined in 1861. There is no information that I can find that says who coined the term "pop" just that it was coined in 1861.   This info can be found at About.com, Wikipedia and other internet sources as well as books. They will give all the history of soda pop with time lines and inventors names but none tell who first called it pop. I have never read any Civil War documents, letters or history, civilian or military, that had the word "pop" in them asscoiated with mineral water, soda water or soft drinks. Besides the "coined in 1861" thing I have only heard of the hutch story but I can find no factual proof to back that theory up either.   After much scrutiny, study, hair pulling, nail bitting and cursing my CP I will go with the only actual, factual (or as close as I can come to it) info I have. My grand dad.   Man this is driving me nuts. Seems like someone would have written down the name of whoever did something as historical and monumental as coining the term "pop" < Message edited by capsoda -- 9/20/2007 11:13:30 PM > _____________________________ Warren Diggin down in Dixie, USA Work is for people who don't dig bottles President, Panhandle Cruisers http://www.panhandlecruisers.org/ (in reply to cowseatmaize) Post #: 14

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/21/2007 9:58:25 AM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline  ERIC...you don't mean "flatulence!?"Ya may be right. Being a proper English poet & writer Southey  may have used popping off to "gently" refer to the act of passing gas... WARREN..now calm down and quit pullin yer hair out. Nice ta see ya been doing some serious researching and, ya made some valid points as well. I like seeing people diggin' for info...However , in attributing the term to your Grandfather are you saying he coined it in 1861 ?  WE always called em "pop bottles" around here when I was a kid. And we used "soda pop" as a term as well. Pop-Kola was once a popular beverage in the South. Back in the 1970's a franchise sort of sprang up around the region for Pop Shoppes...but it was short lived, mainly because it worked like a  pyramid scheme...There was one shoppe that remained open for a few years, but it has since vanished. The NDNR bottles are mainly in landfills, so are quite hard to find.Back to what I was saying: I dunno when the term soda bottle replaced pop bottle around here, but it wasn't that long ago I asked someone if they had any pop bottles for sale and they looked at me as if,  "HUH?" I backed up & said soda bottles, then they knew what I was talkin' about. I toted many a pop bottle to the store for its deposit, which in my younger days was 2c each. But heck: a few cents could getya a bag of candy and  a pop was only  5c. _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com (in reply to capsoda) Post #: 15

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/21/2007 11:03:03 AM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline ROFL...I just recalled something. back in those early days I'd take my bottles to the store for the deposit, select some candy and a pop, then because the deposit was 2c and I was now broke, I'd have to stay at the store and drink the pop...I recall chugging down many a cold bottle of  pop.I also recall watching the store owners who, after receiving complaints that the pop wasn't very cold in their coolers - ( wonder who woulda done that?),  would come out and dip their hands in the cooler water and remove detached paper lables that had clogged the drain, and not allowed the water to circulate/cool properly. Sometimes they'd  pull out gobs of rotted paper...I also used to empty the bottle cap container, and remove the Coke caps cause you could use em on Saturday morinngs to get in the movies free...Other caps,  I inserted in my bicycle spokes... _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 16

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/21/2007 5:28:01 PM    capsoda Posts: 7869 Joined: 11/15/2005 From: Seminole,Alabama, USA Status: offline Nope, Not in 1861. He was born in 1898 and was a kid around the time soda was really becoming popular.  Mearly pointing out that the term "pop" was used by folk who got their soft drink from a hutch bottle. Never knew anyone who was around in 1861 to ask but I had my Grand Dad to ask from the time I dug my first bottle until he was 95. My Aunt Blanch and Aunt Lessi both told me about the marbles that they had from Codd bottles and about lightning stoppers. My Uncle Buckeye knew quite a bit about jars and bottles because he worked in a small glass house somewhere in Missouri when he was a boy. I didn't get to see them as often as my Grand Dad. Also being as the Hutchinson stopper was patent in 1879, # 213,992 and used until at least 1924 in Pensacola, FL. by the Hygeia Coca Cola Bottling Co. I would be inclined to think that it was a better bet that the term "pop" came from the Hutch than some unkown person in 1861 as touted by many sources. Just my reasoning from what I have heard from elders and read in books and on the internet. < Message edited by capsoda -- 9/21/2007 5:47:43 PM > _____________________________ Warren Diggin down in Dixie, USA Work is for people who don't dig bottles President, Panhandle Cruisers http://www.panhandlecruisers.org/ (in reply to whiskeyman) Post #: 17

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/21/2007 8:24:05 PM    cowseatmaize Posts: 2135 Joined: 12/2/2004 From: Metro West, MA Status: offline Hey Warren, I was reading the same timeline thing I think. It was the same thing on all the sites. If they had something to back it up like a name or reference I'd buy it but Ijust don't find the line "The term "pop" first coined" in 1861 as being noteworthy. I'm still trying, the truth is out there. _____________________________ My 10¢ worth (inflation) Eric If you love what your doing it might be illegal, so watch your back. (in reply to capsoda) Post #: 18

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/22/2007 8:32:33 PM    GuntherHess Posts: 5129 Joined: 12/13/2004 From: Frederick Maryland Status: offline A cool 1880s print I found with torpedo lemonade... Attachment (1) _____________________________ Looking for Frederick Maryland and Dr Fahrney Bottles 2008 Medicine Bottle Price Guide on CDROM http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/BottleBook2008.htm email http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/email.jpg (in reply to cowseatmaize) Post #: 19

RE: Origin of term: "POP" Bottle?" - 9/27/2007 4:57:28 PM    whiskeyman Posts: 2019 Joined: 4/17/2005 From: NE TENN-SW VA Status: offline HEY !! I found this old pic of me... Attachment (1) _____________________________ * Member: Bristol Historical Assoc...and, Friends of Steeles Creek Nature Center & Park President: Bristol Tenn-Va Bottle Club Author of: Spirits & Medicinal Bottles of Bristol,TN-VA. My WebSite: www.bristol-tenn-va-bottles.com (in reply to GuntherHess) Post #: 20

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