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Should I bust my Cornucopia?

 
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Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 8:38:14 PM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		My buddy has been doing a few bottle repairs and told me that he would fix my Cornucopia that I bought today. I paid a whooping $37 for it because of this nasty crack.



I still think she's a beauty. Just look at her.



She's all pontiled and everything.



So anyway, he wants to fill the crack. I'm afraid that filling the crack will lead to it traveling and breaking in the future. I was thinking that if I fill this with water and cork it, put it in a small pot and stick it in the freezer that it will finish breaking as easily as possible and I'll have all of the shards for a glue back. If the glue back is done right and the crack is as clean as I'm hoping for then the crack should almost completely disappear. Am I wrong in thinking this way? Swiz



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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 9:00:07 PM   
JOETHECROW


Posts: 9807
Joined: 9/3/2005
From: Northwestern Pa. (Near scenic Lake Perfidy)
Status: online 		Swiz...I think, from working with and collecting glass for a long time, that Hxtal would perhaps fill the crack if done properly with out the risk of multiple cracks from freezing such an old bottle. Not positive, but gentle application of heat might get the resin to flow into the crack...rendering it pretty much invisible. That's how we repair windshield cracks sometimes...
http://www.conservationresources.com/Main/section_34/section34_21.htm

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 9:29:44 PM   
cobaltbot


Posts: 3878
Joined: 4/7/2006
From: Delta, PA
Status: offline 		She is a beauty!

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 9:36:12 PM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		Maybe I should do a test on a thick cracked bottle first? Then again with all the little nooks and crannies on this flask it most likely won't break the same way. 

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Post #: 4
RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 10:13:59 PM   
Plumbata


Posts: 1660
Joined: 12/4/2007
Status: offline 		If you are worried about the crack getting bigger, solving that issue by freezing and breaking it strikes me as rather odd.

I would just go ahead and let your friend work his magic. Stuff like HXTAL would not be widely used on glass if it tended to enlarge existing cracks. That is a nice bottle, hope you can get it repaired adequately.




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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 11:04:08 PM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		I don't think he's using Hxtal. That's why I'm wondering if I should attempt to have it fixed. If it looks good after a repair then my St Drakes is next. 

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 11:24:45 PM   
surfaceone


Posts: 7141
Joined: 12/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

I don't think he's using Hxtal. That's why I'm wondering if I should attempt to have it fixed.


Hey Swizz,

Well, is he using Beemans, or what?

I think the freezing and breaking route would be a mess and result in a historical pile of slivers. I've done the frozen bottle experiment before and had to use a dustpan and broom for clean up.

Not everyone subscribes to my thinking on this.




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Post #: 7
RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/4/2011 11:40:52 PM   
Steve/sewell


Posts: 4295
Joined: 1/23/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: swizzle

My buddy has been doing a few bottle repairs and told me that he would fix my Cornucopia that I bought today. I paid a whooping $37 for it because of this nasty crack.



I still think she's a beauty. Just look at her.



She's all pontiled and everything.



So anyway, he wants to fill the crack. I'm afraid that filling the crack will lead to it traveling and breaking in the future. I was thinking that if I fill this with water and cork it, put it in a small pot and stick it in the freezer that it will finish breaking as easily as possible and I'll have all of the shards for a glue back. If the glue back is done right and the crack is as clean as I'm hoping for then the crack should almost completely disappear. Am I wrong in thinking this way? Swiz


Swiz,hello Mcfly you in there,Who did you consult with to come up with the freeze and break idea this guy...........






Seriously test your friends ability on a throw away med or slick bottle you own that is cracked before you try Dr Kevorkians idea.By the way nice bottle


Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Steve/sewell -- 6/4/2011 11:44:56 PM >

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/5/2011 12:02:55 AM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		The freeze and break was my idea. My thinking behind it was to let the freezing water finish the crack and maybe pop out and easily replaced shard. I'm not talking about letting it freeze solid. checking on it every few minutes to see if the cracked piece could be popped out. I can see that it may just lead to more structural problems. It was just an idea. My thoughts on him filling the crack with whatever he uses was that it may very well cause the crack to travel while adding extra resin or glue residue which may not come off and make a perfect glue back impossible. If there's even a slight possibility of my flask being busted beyond repair from the freeze idea then I just wont do it. But I will test it on several commoners just for kicks to see what happens. Maybe a nice milk of magnesia because of the full frontal embossing. I think that would be my best bet for a decent test. Swiz

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Post #: 9
RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/5/2011 2:06:52 AM   
tigue710


Posts: 4143
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: connecticut - nor cal
Status: offline 		I think you drank your slush puppy to fast! I wouldn't freeze it, the thing I've found about cracked glass is that doesn't usually do what you want it too... There could be a weakness in the glass or all kinds of other factors like potstones that could make it burst... I remember a story about someone setting a sunburst flask in a window and it literally took on it's name sake, burst in the sunlight... Hxtal when used correctly is amazing stuff.... If anything to stabilize the crack...

Nice flask by the way, great color

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/5/2011 7:07:03 AM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		The prices on the cornucopias was all over the place. I saw them priced from this cracked one at $45 to one that was over $600. I just love the old forest glass and decided that I wasn't walking away without a piece this year. Even if the crack never gets fixed it'll still look great on my shelf. Swiz

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Post #: 11
RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/5/2011 9:00:44 AM   
RED Matthews


Posts: 2396
Joined: 8/2/2008
Status: offline 		Hello again;  I just thought I should try to explain the type of crack in swizzlle's flask.  This is an opening of what is called cord stress.  When hot glass is formed, each movement of the hot glass as it is worked and cooled in the process, sets up these cords of stress.  That is the reason for the requirement of annealing, which is supposed to relieve those stress cords.
Don't put it where the changes of temperature are excessive; neither sunlight or freezing.  I think your best approach is what JOETHECROW recommended.  It is truly a nice bottle to have.  The only threat is the stress that might still be there. The textal is probably the best way to hold it together.  RED Matthews


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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/5/2011 8:34:21 PM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		Hey Red are you sure you spelled that right? I searched for textal and got a bunch of links for malware, virus and the occasional porn site?!? I'm hoping to seal cracks in glass not ass!! 

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Post #: 13
RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/5/2011 8:56:20 PM   
RED Matthews


Posts: 2396
Joined: 8/2/2008
Status: offline 		Hi swizzle.  I guess I didn't.   Here is a reference on it - and I was wrong.  Here is the text I had put in a word file.

    George Ingraham post. 6/5/11 I have not tried it yet as have only used for repairing and sealing cracks, fractures and pitting on gemstone cabochons, but the product Hxtal that I am using is actually intended as glass repair. A two part resin/hardener

It sure works excellent for my cabs, and plan on giving it a whirl next time I purchase a snuff bottle with cracks.

I would like ask you all if there is a product some of you have tried for repairing larger chips/chunk broken areas. For around the neck and or mouth area of a bottle.

Something that I am guessing would have to be thick enough so as to be able and be blobbed on over the broken area so that it would not simply run down the bottle ??

Just thinking out loud, but maybe once the larger chunk (if possible) is filled, that the excess might be able to be ground down using some of my silicon carbide belts, then perhaps followed by polishing with some cerium oxide polish ??

Here is another one,
Post by Joe  the crow; Swiz...I think, from working with and collecting glass for a long time, that Hxtal would perhaps fill the crack if done properly with out the risk of multiple cracks from freezing such an old bottle. Not positive, but gentle application of heat might get the resin to flow into the crack...rendering it pretty much invisible. That's how we repair windshield cracks sometimes...
http://www.conservationresources.com/Main/section_34/section34_21.htm Sorry about that - I went too fast I guess.
RED Matthews

< Message edited by RED Matthews -- 6/5/2011 8:58:48 PM >

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/5/2011 10:15:30 PM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		Now if Hxtal drys clear then it shouldn't show in a crack, right? I can see it showing if you used it to replace a missing chunk though. Am I right in assuming this? I really want to buy some but that price is crazy. But then again I don't want to use crazy glue on a cornucopia.  Thanx for the info Red. 

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Post #: 15
RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/6/2011 9:51:40 AM   
cowseatmaize


Posts: 6472
Joined: 12/2/2004
From: Eastern Northwest West Central area of Mass
Status: offline 		Joe does glass work so trust that.
If your theory is to get it to continue cracking to the exact spot on the other side and have a perfect joining of two halves than don't test that theory. I think you'll end up with too many halves.
Cold contracts, heat expands. Freezing can create condensation and heat will dry it. Moisture wouldn't be wanted.
Before or maybe during the fill, warming would be the way to go.
I think the best solution would be to do the whole process in the Arizona dessert but you'll have to do it quickly there. The mixture will harden much quicker.
Tell us how it went when you get home or while your there.

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/6/2011 9:59:14 AM   
GuntherHess


Posts: 11470
Joined: 12/13/2004
From: Frederick Maryland
Status: offline 		I say melt it down and blow a new one with the glass, crack problem solved

HXTAL can be whatever color you decide to dye it. If you are just filling a crack leaving it clear is probably ok.

< Message edited by GuntherHess -- 6/6/2011 10:00:31 AM >

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/8/2011 6:17:30 PM   
andy volkerts


Posts: 795
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline 		   NO NO NO NO let your buddy repair it.....Andy

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RE: Should I bust my Cornucopia? - 6/9/2011 4:13:07 PM   
swizzle


Posts: 3596
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: Upstate NY
Status: offline 		If I melt this sucker down its getting a puce applied top. 

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