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All Forums >> [Bottle Forums] >> Reproduction bottles and jars. >> Naval boarding weapons

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Naval boarding weapons - 12/4/2007 5:06:54 PM    bamascavenger Posts: 272 Joined: 9/1/2007 From: Al. Status: offline Asked seller about these "weapons"/ bottles and how many he had. Is he on the up and up? Or is it another repro scam? Link to sells; http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360000969451&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123 His letter;  Dear bamascavenger, We bought about 40 out of a Philadelphia maritime collection and recovered about a dozen diving. - sirmarkw _____________________________ Army Rangers Lead The Way! Post #: 1

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/4/2007 6:25:12 PM    tigue710 Posts: 1646 Joined: 7/11/2007 From: connecticut Status: offline that is the same freaking guy, it is a SCAM! _____________________________ aint no bottles in there.... (in reply to bamascavenger) Post #: 2

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/4/2007 6:31:18 PM    GuntherHess Posts: 4901 Joined: 12/13/2004 From: Frederick Maryland Status: offline When you see people selling fake scrimshaw that's a good sign to RUN FOR THE HILLS _____________________________ Looking for Frederick Maryland and Dr Fahrney Bottles 2008 Medicine Bottle Price Guide on CDROM http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/BottleBook2008.htm email http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/email.jpg (in reply to tigue710) Post #: 3

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/5/2007 11:29:36 AM    lobeycat Posts: 3593 Joined: 9/8/2003 From: RED SOX Nation Status: online nothing about those crazy looking bottles looks remotely antique. but the clown sells them. I'm guessing to new collectors. Thats why he keeps his bidders private on these items. the bidders on his other items are listed, I'm sure people where contacting them and filling them in. _____________________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc86_Weoye0 ya never come back (in reply to GuntherHess) Post #: 4

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/5/2007 5:29:14 PM    CALDIGR2   Posts: 465 Joined: 6/20/2005 Status: offline SirMarkW(for wanker) is a rotten liar and a scammer who should be locked up for mail fraud. How he gets away with passing that crap off as "naval boarding weapons" is beyond me. I would love to shove one of those up his arse. _____________________________ Mike Dig no privy before it's time. (in reply to lobeycat) Post #: 5

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/7/2007 2:42:12 AM    cc6pack   Posts: 509 Joined: 7/12/2003 From: Mableton, Ga. Status: offline Mike lets be civil here at least offer him some KY jelly before inserting Here's the discussions that took place earlier on this jerk http://www.antique-bottles.net/forum/searchpro.asp?phrase=sirmarkw&author=&forumid=ALL&topicreply=both&message=body&timeframe=%3E&timefilter=0&language=single&top=300&criteria=AND&minRank=0&sortMethod=r&submitbutton=+OK+ (in reply to CALDIGR2) Post #: 6

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/8/2007 3:52:46 PM    lobeycat Posts: 3593 Joined: 9/8/2003 From: RED SOX Nation Status: online I emailed the guy (just can't help myself sometimes) and asked him a few pointblank questions. his responce... The bottles came out of a Freeman Brothers auction in Philadelphia about 30 years ago. It was a maritime auction. Most thought they were grog bottles including us until a London curator showed us an 1800s painting of one lying on the deck of a ship next to a cannon. We have not been able to relocate the painting which is not a surprise because prints are not commonly made from artworks. There is a lot of dispute over authenticity. However, most of the dispute comes from a same group of the bottle collecting fools that are not maritime experts and certainly do not understand glass chemistry. Most of them have managed to get themselves banned from Ebay for their auction interference. No art glass bottles of this type were ever produced in Mexico. Similar ones have surfaced in the Middle East but they are somewhat different when examined in person.   One thing struck me odd. I spoke to the chump that tried to sell the $500,000 ale bottle and these two sounded very similar. Might just be my paranoia..... _____________________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc86_Weoye0 ya never come back (in reply to cc6pack) Post #: 7

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/8/2007 10:38:42 PM    GuntherHess Posts: 4901 Joined: 12/13/2004 From: Frederick Maryland Status: offline From what I have read grog was a mixed concoction of several ingrediants. It was not something that would have been bottled. The rum part of it would have been in a bottle or the beer part in a cask. His story seems to change like the wind. Akin to the trackers of Big Foot, there is always an excuse for each piece of missing evidence. Extraordinary claims alway require extraordinary proof. < Message edited by GuntherHess -- 12/8/2007 10:40:22 PM > _____________________________ Looking for Frederick Maryland and Dr Fahrney Bottles 2008 Medicine Bottle Price Guide on CDROM http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/BottleBook2008.htm email http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/email.jpg (in reply to lobeycat) Post #: 8

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/9/2007 2:35:31 AM    druggistnut Posts: 312 Joined: 1/7/2006 Status: offline I thought I had that guy gone from eBay. OK, this is going to take some elbow grease. ANYONE interested in helping, contact me. I want to see him gone from eBay and possibly prosecuted. Go back through his 2000 plus feedbacks, you should see some interesting things. I know there were several people on this site and another site who had it out with this clown. Send me their names, if you would. Bill _____________________________ Michigan drugstore bottles/dose glasses, jugs, etc... Any paper from Mich drugstores, pre 1900. Mich. blob beers/sodas, hutches. Anything unusual from Michigan, i.e., paper from bottlers, etc... Buy or trade President-Flint, Michigan FOHBC Club (in reply to bamascavenger) Post #: 9

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/9/2007 9:22:08 AM    lobeycat Posts: 3593 Joined: 9/8/2003 From: RED SOX Nation Status: online Appears to be a new batch brought up from Davey Jones locker Tall Teardrop 1800's Purple Glass Naval Boarding Weapon    This guy pretty much has the bases covered. Private bidders are hard to contact _____________________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc86_Weoye0 ya never come back (in reply to druggistnut) Post #: 10

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/9/2007 9:28:14 AM    cowseatmaize Posts: 2135 Joined: 12/2/2004 From: Metro West, MA Status: offline Check out this headline, the rest isn't of any relevance. http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/103-05222007-1350228.html _____________________________ My 10¢ worth (inflation) Eric If you love what your doing it might be illegal, so watch your back. (in reply to druggistnut) Post #: 11

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/9/2007 10:26:02 AM    GuntherHess Posts: 4901 Joined: 12/13/2004 From: Frederick Maryland Status: offline ...he secretly sold off the museum's vast collection of naval boarding weapons....NOT _____________________________ Looking for Frederick Maryland and Dr Fahrney Bottles 2008 Medicine Bottle Price Guide on CDROM http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/BottleBook2008.htm email http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/email.jpg (in reply to cowseatmaize) Post #: 12

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/9/2007 11:48:12 AM    cc6pack   Posts: 509 Joined: 7/12/2003 From: Mableton, Ga. Status: offline About the only thing we can do is report the auction, there's a REPORT button at the bottom of every auction.  There's a drop  down menu for fraudulent listings. Maybe if everyone hits the button ebay may take notice, I'll also email a manager that handles collectibles to see if we can get help that way. Example: Enter item number(s): 360001895806 Up to 10 items separated by commas (example: 1365609580, 1748176843) Enter your question / concern: seller canot prove the item is a grenade, and has sold many of these in the past. He has even stated that there were only a few found. Please contact someone that you trust that knows antique glass for an opinion. 9787 character left. No HTML, JavaScript. (in reply to GuntherHess) Post #: 13

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/9/2007 1:37:09 PM    lobeycat Posts: 3593 Joined: 9/8/2003 From: RED SOX Nation Status: online These are not only not (?) grenades they're obivously Mexican souvenirs. Tourist crap. the one he has listed is purple for Christ's sake _____________________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc86_Weoye0 ya never come back (in reply to cc6pack) Post #: 14

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 12/9/2007 1:58:45 PM    capsoda Posts: 7703 Joined: 11/15/2005 From: Seminole,Alabama, USA Status: offline (an 1800s painting of one lying on the deck of a ship next to a cannon.) Yep, it was there cause the salior just empetied it when he saw that he was about to die by the sword of John LeFeet the bare foot pirate!!!! Some people are just so ignorant that it hurts. Your supposed to through these things (with their 1/2 inch glass thickness) aganst a wooden ship and do what????? Dent it????? It would take a giant gorilla type dude to throw one hard enough to breake it against wood.   Cavet Emptor or Stupid!!!! _____________________________ Warren Diggin down in Dixie, USA Work is for people who don't dig bottles President, Panhandle Cruisers http://www.panhandlecruisers.org/ (in reply to lobeycat) Post #: 15

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 2/29/2008 7:25:33 PM    aridice53   Posts: 150 Joined: 2/20/2008 From: Huntsville, AL Status: offline Hi All, I found this topic fascinating, so I did a little research. Until I read these posts I had never heard of these "Boarding Weapons". and other than this guy's listings at Ebay, there's no other reference to them by that name (nor "Deck Sweepers") on the internet. But, the concept of exploding bottles is indeed viable. If anyone's interested, here's what I found..... http://books.google.com/books?id=GmQVan-M3ykC&pg=PA182&lpg=PA182&dq=crimean+war+grenades&source=web&ots=cTKEHG154V&sig=45uJ-G8Xe4gImP0Quq9i3y1mDjw&hl=en#PPA180,M1 page 180-183 covers the history of grenades, and yep, there were some made of glass. But it seems most were improvisation, not, the norm. Found this reference I guess its an exact transcript of the letter, a little hard to understand): In a letter to his sister, Colonel Robert Hugh Hibbert, described an improvised grenade used during the Crimean War (1854-1856): We have a new invention to irritate our friends in their pools. It consists of filling water bottles full of empty soda powder, twisted and old nails or other sharp cut you get at the moment, remains a little trailer in a fuse for lighting and then throwing quickly in the pit where our Rays neighbours, to his great annoyance. You can imagine his anger at seeing a bottle of water with gas are falling into a hole full of men with a little burning fuse far as proud as a veritable explosion of shell and burying itself in soft flesh. And this is a reference to the Cofederates using bottles as grenades during the battle at Vicksburg. http://www.historynet.com/magazines/american_civil_war/9647007.html Interesting.....glass was used for this purpose but, it does seem that the preferred material was metal. Char (in reply to capsoda) Post #: 16

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 3/1/2008 3:52:51 AM    JGUIS   Posts: 1700 Joined: 3/18/2006 From: New Lexington, OH Status: offline Everything I've read about glass "boarding weapons" wasn't grenades, but molotave cocktails.  "A bottle full of rum, stuffed with a bit of cloth." _____________________________ A pipe gives a wise man time to think, and gives a fool something to stick in his mouth. (in reply to aridice53) Post #: 17

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 3/1/2008 5:58:42 AM    aridice53   Posts: 150 Joined: 2/20/2008 From: Huntsville, AL Status: offline Josh, If you read the "grenade" article, it refers to glass filled with flamable liquid, as well as powder and schrapnel. All of them were fused. Aside from the guy selling them on ebay, there is no other reference to them being called "boarding weapons" or "deck sweepers" They were designed to explode, not break on impact. Char (in reply to JGUIS) Post #: 18

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 3/1/2008 7:36:04 AM    GuntherHess Posts: 4901 Joined: 12/13/2004 From: Frederick Maryland Status: offline If they did implement these grenades they would have used contemporary black glass spirit bottles not modern fantasy bottles. < Message edited by GuntherHess -- 3/1/2008 7:38:14 AM > _____________________________ Looking for Frederick Maryland and Dr Fahrney Bottles 2008 Medicine Bottle Price Guide on CDROM http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/BottleBook2008.htm email http://www.mattsoldhouse.com/MC/bottles/email.jpg (in reply to aridice53) Post #: 19

RE: Naval boarding weapons - 3/1/2008 8:31:04 AM    kungfufighter   Posts: 170 Joined: 2/18/2005 Status: offline Well said.  Not only are the referenced bottles modern "junque" but in a more general sense, the notion that there were bottles specifically designed for such a purpose is pure and simple bunk.  _____________________________ www.jeffnholantiquebottles.com www.noordsyantiques.com (in reply to GuntherHess) Post #: 20

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