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All Forums >> [Bottle Forums] >> What is it? AFTER 1900 >> APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES

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APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 11:39:52 AM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline Hey there everyone, Can anyone help me identify and date these two bottles?? the are just about an inch high. they have metal tops with a cork. Any help would be great! Thank You in advance for your help! Post #: 1

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 12:40:08 PM    Harry Pristis   Posts: 495 Joined: 7/24/2003 From: Northcentral Florida Status: offline The printing on the skull label -- what does it say? One inch tall?! ...with or without the stopper? Are you confident that the stoppers are original to the bottles? Are they machine-made bottles or hand-finished? They look like ink bottles, except for the skull label. ---------Harry Pristis _____________________________ ______________________________________________ Visit The Demijohn Page at: http://members.aol.com/pristis/index.html (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 2

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 1:47:13 PM    crozet86 Posts: 142 Joined: 2/17/2004 From: Charlottesville va. / Buena Vista Va. Status: offline Bearfan, That is a toughie there.They look taller than an inch even without the stoppers. Im with Harry in thinking they look like inks.What does it say on the skull label? Eddie (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 3

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 1:53:14 PM    Maine Digger   Posts: 823 Joined: 2/4/2004 From: Augusta, Maine Status: offline Bearfan, the poison label looks out of place to me, almost like it was added after the fact. Where did you get these? Any chance these are fantasy creations? What's everyone else think? _____________________________ Norm Miller (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 4

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 5:52:13 PM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline here is everything I know. I got these at an antique store. I actually got a tape meassure out. They are just under 2.5 inches from the tip of the crown to the bottom of the bottle. Without the stopper they the bottle is 1.75 inches. I do not know if the stoppers are original to the bottles. I have providid 2 more pics of the label and stopper. I am hoping these are not fantasy or ink, I paid $50.00 for both. There was a written description that came with the bottles that read: 2 rare appthecary poison mini bottles "Absolutely amazing and rare apothecary Green and Clear glass mini bottles. These bottles are in superb condition, wry well preserved, there are no cracks or scratches. The bottles both have very nice stoppers that have the appearance of a crown" Please don't tell me I was taken to the cleaners with these. I thought they were something unique. Holding my head down feeling stupid at the moment. I should also mention that the original price for these was $100.00 and I asked them if they would take $50.00 and they agreed. it was at a group shop. the shop had to call the dealer. (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 5

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 7:08:05 PM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline here are some better pics of the bottom and of the bottles. the green bottle seems to have a ridge. the clear bottle does not have this ridge. (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 6

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 7:35:06 PM    Harry Pristis   Posts: 495 Joined: 7/24/2003 From: Northcentral Florida Status: offline Does the label marking say O*ACHO ("danger") in Russian? (* here represents a Cyrilic letter--like the symbol for "Pi".) It is pronounced o-PAHS-no. How are these labels affixed to the glass? ...baked enamel? ...paper labels glued to the glass? Describe. The form of these bottles is that of an American-made "square inkwell" from the late 19th to the early 20th century (these bottles are slightly smaller than the average square inkwell, from my quick scan of Covill's illustrations). Show us a pic of the lips without the stoppers, and we'll tell you if they are hand-finished or later machine-bottles (big difference in collector value). The stoppers look like those I've seen on cosmetics bottles (lotions, hair tonic) from the turn of the century. Are the cork liners stained or natural-looking? At the turn of the 19th century, Russia was Europeanized and was importing lots of western goods. I just don't know about these bottles yet -- collector items, curiosities, or frauds. --------------Harry Pristis _____________________________ ______________________________________________ Visit The Demijohn Page at: http://members.aol.com/pristis/index.html (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 7

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 7:42:16 PM    woody   Posts: 1634 Joined: 10/29/2002 From: Gilmanton, New Hampshire Status: offline Hmmm........ I think they may be of European or Russian origin. What is the significance of the crowns on the top? The label looks like it may be in Russian writing. Hard to say if it is real or a concoction that someone put together. It does look to be blown in a mold. I don't think it's an ink as the top is too large of an opening. Strange............ _____________________________ Woody (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 8

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 8:03:37 PM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline here you go---I could not get the top off the green bottle. The metal seams to be very soft snd beds easily. I did not want to cause any damage to it so I did not force it to come out. thanks for all your information guys. (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 9

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 8:10:44 PM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline sorry I forgot to mention that the label is paper, I do not know how it was affixed to the bottles the bottles have a 3/4 inch opening. (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 10

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 8:24:05 PM    woody   Posts: 1634 Joined: 10/29/2002 From: Gilmanton, New Hampshire Status: offline Does the top of the crown top unscrew? _____________________________ Woody (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 11

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 8:25:54 PM    Harry Pristis   Posts: 495 Joined: 7/24/2003 From: Northcentral Florida Status: offline I don't think the mouth is too large, Woody. The bottle without the stopper is only 1.75" tall -- these are very small, like "travelling" inks. I see now that bearfan has stated the mouth opening is .75". No problem. I have two cobalt "square inkwells" with mouth-openings of .75" and .875". The mouths of Carter's 1897 cone inks in a recent thread are .75" wide. These latest pix do indicate that these are hand-finished bottles, the green one almost certainly. As travelling inkwells, I think the owner is not gonna' be economically devastated by the investment he made. Still, there are those nagging labels. Did the Russians re-cycle these little bottles to hold samples of enriched uranium? Do your hands glow in the dark, bearfan? ----------Harry Pristis < Message edited by Harry Pristis -- 3/13/2004 1:18:26 AM > _____________________________ ______________________________________________ Visit The Demijohn Page at: http://members.aol.com/pristis/index.html (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 12

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 8:32:44 PM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline The top to the crowns do unscrew. They do not however come off---the get to a certain poit and then stop. If you want any more pictures please let me know. This is a bit of fun just trying to figure it out, that may be worth the invesment alone except if somone came along and said it was a recycled avon bottle!!! (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 13

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 8:46:04 PM    woody   Posts: 1634 Joined: 10/29/2002 From: Gilmanton, New Hampshire Status: offline What does the bottom of the cork look like? Is it hollow? I'm thinking that those type of crown tops I've seen on Holy water bottles that the tops unscrew to sprinkle the water. _____________________________ Woody (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 14

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 8:52:43 PM    woody   Posts: 1634 Joined: 10/29/2002 From: Gilmanton, New Hampshire Status: offline If it was an ink bottle, Harry, I believe the cork would be stained with the color of the ink, which it doesn't appear to be. The label and top may not be from the bottle, though. Of course this could be something that someone fabricated to pique someones curiosity. _____________________________ Woody (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 15

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 9:12:34 PM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline Woody, the corks are hollow with the metal from the crown coming to the very bottom of the cork. Hmmmm from inkwells to holly water.....all that from what I thought was or still may be a poison bottle. I am not an expert---I just thought that they were neat looking. I like the crowns and I thought the labels were interesting. I am looking all over the web following your suggestions to hopefully find out some more information. (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 16

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 9:14:57 PM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline if nothing else, these will be very well photographed bottles I have! (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 17

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 9:19:51 PM    Harry Pristis   Posts: 495 Joined: 7/24/2003 From: Northcentral Florida Status: offline Yes, Woody, the stoppers are suspect, as are the labels. That has been my direction from the start. The bottles themselves, however, seem to be perfectly good, hand-finished, inkiforms (new term). They are good matches, but smaller, to "square inkwells" illustrated in Covill's book. The green is a very desirable color. There's no telling what these bottles were used for secondarily, though we can say that they are not known poison bottles nor are they known cosmetics bottles. Without the stoppers and bogus(?) labels, I think ink collectors would snap these up. One way to check is to take them to a bottle show and show them to a few serious ink and poison collectors. I might leave the stoppers in my pocket initially. Let us know what you find out, bearfan. ------------Harry Pristis _____________________________ ______________________________________________ Visit The Demijohn Page at: http://members.aol.com/pristis/index.html (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 18

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/12/2004 10:13:39 PM    Maine Digger   Posts: 823 Joined: 2/4/2004 From: Augusta, Maine Status: offline Bearfan, something you said earlier caught my attention, you said the metal on the stoppers was very 'soft'. Is there any chance that metal is stearling silver? I've come across old silver in some of my digs on various objects, so i was just wondering. Harry is right though, those are a lot better looking without the stoppers. You might want to think about whether those labels should stay put or not. That's was interesting about this hobby, quite often something comes along that really makes you work at identification, and the payoff is always there, rare or common, real or fake, you always walk away having learned something. _____________________________ Norm Miller (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 19

RE: APOTHECARY POISON TWO BOTTLES - 3/13/2004 9:35:09 AM    bearfan   Posts: 68 Joined: 3/12/2004 From: new hampshire Status: offline hhmmm, I have bought many things in the past, and never have I had to take something away from an item to make it more interesting. Here is a thought, and mind you this may be very naive thinking here. The stoppers fit the bottle perfectly. The corks stop where they should, and the rim of the metal matches up with the rim of each bottle perfectly. What are the chances in the wild that a bottle is found, and then a cork that fits it perfectly is also found. Now double that equation. It just seems odd the stoppers fit so perfectly, but are not original to the bottle. Say the stoppers were fabricated for the bottle, why would someone go through so much trouble to do this??? I would be afraid to take them apart only to find that I actually had a real unique item and destroyed it. I am going to try and contact the dealer through the shop to see if I can find out where he may have gotten them. I will let you all know what I find out. This has been a learning experience for me. I now know for sure that I got my moneys worth in knowledge, even if the bottles only turn out to be worth a couple bucks. Thank You all for your help. John (in reply to bearfan) Post #: 20

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