Help identifying beer/wine (?) squat bottle.

tropichahni · Feb 22, 2017

Here is another bottle I have which brings up a lot of questions. I see ring marks consistently through the bottle, so does that identify it as a turn molded bottle? I see no visible seams on neither the bottle nor be applied finish. Am I correct in identifying this as an applied finish? I see two places where the glass has seeped down past the application point. This bottle confuses me because of the applied finish and the shine. I'm looking for more information to help me continue to identify bottles. Any help in identifying and correcting me in this process is appreciated. I'm looking for the age usage and value of a bottle like this. Thank you

diggansearch · Feb 22, 2017

Nice bottle tropichahni !
This brings up some questions to me too. However it´s definitly a turnned tool finish one.
It dates 1900´s. See in this page "What is it before 1900" and "What is it after 1900" forums.

tropichahni · Feb 22, 2017

diggansearch said:
Nice bottle tropichahni !
This brings up some questions to me too. However it´s definitly a turnned tool finish one.
It dates 1900´s. See in this page "What is it before 1900" and "What is it after 1900" forums.

What do you mean by "tool finish" ? I thought tooled was when the finish was tooled on and you can see the tool finish between the top and the next where it blends into the other. I thought this spilling of the glass around the connection was "applied" finish. Is there more clarification on this? Where can I find that?

whittled · Feb 23, 2017

I think e's referring to Turn Mold.

sandchip · Feb 23, 2017

The bottle was turned in the mold after blowing but before removal, then separated from the blowpipe after removal from the mold, and the top applied and tooled to shape. They really had to hustle in applying a band of hot glass to the top of the neck, resulting in the bit of excess which was mashed against the neck by the underside of the lipping tool. The bottle was being held horizontally during this process, so it's not where glass ran down the neck as you so often hear. The glass is quite viscous and wouldn't run in that state at that point during the manufacturing process. Hope this helps.

Nice bottle, by the way!

botlguy · Feb 23, 2017

Be careful what you believe. I see some misinformation in the responses. Sandchip says it best. It appears to be an 1870 - 80 English / European ale bottle. Applied finish means a separate piece of glass applied, tooled means finishing with the original gather.

Note: I can be mistaken, search further.
Jim

Harry Pristis · Feb 23, 2017

I would describe this bottle as a TOC19 medicinal (we call them 'dietary supplements' these days) for beef broth or 'liquid bread' or similar. It's probably American-made.

My understanding is, with the improvement of molds late in the 19th Century, application of a separate bit of glass for the lip was no longer necessary. Cecil Munsey refers to these as 'full height molds.' The date of that transition was about 1880.

I collect demijohns, so testing for an applied lip is easy: I can stick a finger into the mouth of one of these bottles and feel for a ridge where the join was made. Feel for it, that is, if it is not visible when held to the light.

Lipping tools were adopted in the USA about 1850, according to Munsey. No matter which way the lip glass was in place, some excess glass may be squeezed beyond the lipping tool. Not a drip, as sandchip correctly points out.

Turn-mold or paste-mold bottles had a brief popularity at the TOC19. But, turn-mold bottles couldn't be embossed, so they didn't compete successfully with embossed bottles, especially after slug plates became available in the latter 1800s.

Here's an exaggerated example of a lipping tool used on an applied lip. It's a very neat lip, but a very crude join in the neck of the bottle.

[SUP][/SUP]

diggansearch · Feb 23, 2017

Hello all !
I have got many bottles with finish like this but the interior of the necks are different .
Many have no marks inside the neck. Many other have a circular groove inside like two pieces joined toghether and some have an irregular ridge.
Because of it I doubt your bottle has realy an applied lip.
In my opinion the bottle turned in the mold still after the blow pipe was separated .
Then , still turning, a lipping tool shape using same glass from the previous crude top.
Note: Forgive my bad English.

tropichahni · Feb 23, 2017

Harry Pristis said:
I
I collect demijohns, so testing for an applied lip is easy: I can stick a finger into the mouth of one of these bottles and feel for a ridge where the join was made. Feel for it, that is, if it is not visible when held to the light.

Lipping tools were adopted in the USA about 1850, according to Munsey. No matter which way the lip glass was in place, some excess glass may be squeezed beyond the lipping tool. Not a drip, as sandchip correctly points out.

Turn-mold or paste-mold bottles had a brief popularity at the

[SUP][/SUP]View attachment 177202

I looked with a flashlight as well as felt inside. Let me try to describe it the best I can. There is an uneven ridge but not large. when I look at it ... it looks as if the glass has been pulled up into the mouth and formed this ridge. like it was adhered by pulling and smoothing the bottle neck glass up into the mouth. Does this sound like what you mention?

Harry Pristis · Feb 24, 2017

Could be we see the weld between the body and an applied lip. The weld looks pressed in place by the rod portion of the lipping tool which is inserted into the opening.

Help identifying beer/wine (?) squat bottle.

Welcome to our Antique Bottle community

Be a part of something great, join today!

tropichahni

Active Member

Attachments

diggansearch

Member

tropichahni

Active Member

whittled

Well-Known Member

sandchip

Well-Known Member

botlguy

Well-Known Member

Harry Pristis

Well-Known Member

diggansearch

Member

tropichahni

Active Member

Attachments

Harry Pristis

Well-Known Member

Similar threads

Latest posts

Members online

Latest threads

Forum statistics

Share this page

Online statistics

Forum statistics