Attic Finds

[East_Tn_Bottle_Guy]

Borden pimento paper label dual purpose container/drinking glass

Lange/Depere Wis. ABM

Other slicks and miscellaneous

 

[DavidW]

Hi East_Tn_Bottle_Guy, My post here is only about your clear Fincastle Whiskey bottle with the Owens-Illinois mark on the bottom: Owens-Illinois had two major types of "number/code arrangements" on their bottles. The most common arrangement (for many kinds of bottles such as soda, medicine and chemical bottles) has a factory location code to the left of the logo, and a date code to the right of the logo. And usually a mold number underneath the logo.

BUT your bottle is a liquor bottle, and all the liquor bottles made by Owens-Illinois (well, most of the older ones, anyway) had a different configuration............. there are usually two numbers, separated by a dash, with the "Diamond/oval/I" logo off to the side, sometimes turned on it's side (placed vertically), such as on your bottle. Those two numbers are (first) a liquor bottle permit number, the dash, and then the date code.

So, in your case, the "65" is a liquor bottle permit number and that number stands for their Streator, Illinois plant. The "45" is a date code and yes that does stand for 1945.

The "D 344" is a distiller code number, it stood for the actual distiller of the whiskey that was in the bottle.
There are lists of liquor bottle permits online. I would like to eventually compile a complete list of LBPN's and have them all on one page on my site (glassbottlemarks) , maybe I can do this sooner or later.

The arrangement of those codes cause a lot of confusion when collectors try to "read" the codes on a liquor bottle in exactly the same way as on their other bottles, which doesn't quite work.

Hope this makes sense!

 

[East_Tn_Bottle_Guy]

Hi East_Tn_Bottle_Guy, My post here is only about your clear Fincastle Whiskey bottle with the Owens-Illinois mark on the bottom: Owens-Illinois had two major types of "number/code arrangements" on their bottles. The most common arrangement (for many kinds of bottles such as soda, medicine and chemical bottles) has a factory location code to the left of the logo, and a date code to the right of the logo. And usually a mold number underneath the logo.

BUT your bottle is a liquor bottle, and all the liquor bottles made by Owens-Illinois (well, most of the older ones, anyway) had a different configuration............. there are usually two numbers, separated by a dash, with the "Diamond/oval/I" logo off to the side, sometimes turned on it's side (placed vertically), such as on your bottle. Those two numbers are (first) a liquor bottle permit number, the dash, and then the date code.

So, in your case, the "65" is a liquor bottle permit number and that number stands for their Streator, Illinois plant. The "45" is a date code and yes that does stand for 1945.

The "D 344" is a distiller code number, it stood for the actual distiller of the whiskey that was in the bottle.
There are lists of liquor bottle permits online. I would like to eventually compile a complete list of LBPN's and have them all on one page on my site (glassbottlemarks) , maybe I can do this sooner or later.

The arrangement of those codes cause a lot of confusion when collectors try to "read" the codes on a liquor bottle in exactly the same way as on their other bottles, which doesn't quite work.

Hope this makes sense!

Yes it makes complete sense. Thanks for your time and effort.

 

[Csa]

Hi East_Tn_Bottle_Guy, My post here is only about your clear Fincastle Whiskey bottle with the Owens-Illinois mark on the bottom: Owens-Illinois had two major types of "number/code arrangements" on their bottles. The most common arrangement (for many kinds of bottles such as soda, medicine and chemical bottles) has a factory location code to the left of the logo, and a date code to the right of the logo. And usually a mold number underneath the logo.

BUT your bottle is a liquor bottle, and all the liquor bottles made by Owens-Illinois (well, most of the older ones, anyway) had a different configuration............. there are usually two numbers, separated by a dash, with the "Diamond/oval/I" logo off to the side, sometimes turned on it's side (placed vertically), such as on your bottle. Those two numbers are (first) a liquor bottle permit number, the dash, and then the date code.

So, in your case, the "65" is a liquor bottle permit number and that number stands for their Streator, Illinois plant. The "45" is a date code and yes that does stand for 1945.

The "D 344" is a distiller code number, it stood for the actual distiller of the whiskey that was in the bottle.
There are lists of liquor bottle permits online. I would like to eventually compile a complete list of LBPN's and have them all on one page on my site (glassbottlemarks) , maybe I can do this sooner or later.

The arrangement of those codes cause a lot of confusion when collectors try to "read" the codes on a liquor bottle in exactly the same way as on their other bottles, which doesn't quite work.

Hope this makes sense!

Good explanation, I wish you would please compile a list. I have about 20 post prohibition bottles and find the online lists of distillers and rectifiers to be confusing and spotty. Maybe my sleuthing needs some work

 

[DavidW]

Good explanation, I wish you would please compile a list. I have about 20 post prohibition bottles and find the online lists of distillers and rectifiers to be confusing and spotty. Maybe my sleuthing needs some work

Hi Csa,
I was only referring to compiling a list of Liquor Bottle Permit Numbers, not the D-numbers (distiller numbers) or R-numbers (rectifier numbers). Anyway, there is very little good, comprehensive info on distiller numbers or rectifier numbers online, but here is a page someone (I don't know who) had put together several years ago. It has at least SOME numbers that are frequently seen.......... https://static1.squarespace.com/static/51379b83e4b02119d184b2a2/t/584a336ee4fcb59adb85c48b/1481257838281/User+Permit+numbers.pdf

Here are a couple pages with Liquor bottle permit numbers:
https://sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/LiquorBottlePermits.pdf

ALSO.... This URL was generated by Bob Stahr (who is a researcher and authority on Hemingray Glass Co) and he sent it to me some time ago........... this includes a number of Liquor bottle permit numbers that are NOT listed in the webpage above....
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt...TO WHOM PERMITS TO MANUFACTURE LIQUOR BOTTLES

 

[East_Tn_Bottle_Guy]

Some of the bottles still have the cork in them. Would a corkscrew break them or is there a better way to get them out intact?

 

[Csa]

Hi Csa,
I was only referring to compiling a list of Liquor Bottle Permit Numbers, not the D-numbers (distiller numbers) or R-numbers (rectifier numbers). Anyway, there is very little good, comprehensive info on distiller numbers or rectifier numbers online, but here is a page someone (I don't know who) had put together several years ago. It has at least SOME numbers that are frequently seen.......... https://static1.squarespace.com/static/51379b83e4b02119d184b2a2/t/584a336ee4fcb59adb85c48b/1481257838281/User+Permit+numbers.pdf

Here are a couple pages with Liquor bottle permit numbers:
https://sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/LiquorBottlePermits.pdf

ALSO.... This URL was generated by Bob Stahr (who is a researcher and authority on Hemingray Glass Co) and he sent it to me some time ago........... this includes a number of Liquor bottle permit numbers that are NOT listed in the webpage above....
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uc1.$c127996&view=1up&seq=26&q1=LIST OF GLASS MANUFACTURERS TO WHOM PERMITS TO MANUFACTURE LIQUOR BOTTLES

Thanks. I’ve seen the first one only. Some good addl clues for sure.

 

[jc_john1]

It may not be the oldest bottle in there -- But I have a penchant for Borden's bottles and wow, Pimento Cocktail Spread is one I haven't seen before. (Maybe I should get out more)

 

[Huntindog]

Some of the bottles still have the cork in them. Would a corkscrew break them or is there a better way to get them out intact?

All of those corks will be too dry for a corkscrew.
If I were to want to try to remove them in one piece, I think maybe one of those injector needles might work.

 

[East_Tn_Bottle_Guy]

Alright, will try that. Thanks