Digging an 1870 to 1915 bottle plant up date. QUESTIONS

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CanadianBottles

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Interesting that you're finding so many blank Hutches. Those were typically only used by companies which were early adopters of the style in their area so they weren't worried about their competitors stealing them, or companies which couldn't afford to have their own bottles embossed. I'm even more confident now that you're digging the dump of a bottler which was buying bottles second hand from other companies. You wouldn't typically expect to find Hutchinsons from Kentucky, New York, and Illinois in the same dump - especially not a dump in West Virginia. These were pretty much never distributed very far outside the city where the bottler was located.
You would expect to find a mix like that at a glass company dump as well, but I've never heard of any glasshouses which only made soda bottles. The coal would make sense for a bottler if they were using it to power their machinery, and a bottling plant was an industrial operation so the machinery parts make sense as well. The slag glass I'm not sure about - maybe threw trash into the furnace?
Unless you live in a very unpopulated part of West Virginia, there was probably a bottling plant at some point in your general vicinity. You might need to go digging deep in the archives to find records of it though, especially if they never used any bottles embossed with their own name. Sometimes the dump wouldn't be right by the operation either. I was once digging a dump which was clearly used almost exclusively by one downtown hotel, but it was in a bizarre spot that would have been outside the city limits in those days and quite far from any roads.
 

HotDiggerDog

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Hello all you wonderful bottle people. Well it day 3 of digging this old Bottle Manufacturing plant. So far I have found 22 Hutch bottles that are whole. I have found 7 crown tops that are whole and 8 billion crown tops with broken tops. I'm amazed that I'm finding so many whole hutch bottles so I'm thinking that they tossed all those bottles because they where no longer in use. Lots of labels Digging as slowed down because I'm up against some very large pieces of iron. So I'm thinking a new approach and start digging to the left on the other side of the old stump. The soil is very compact It takes almost an hour to remove one bottle. Okay now that I have all these bottles I have QUESTIONS AND MORE QUESTIONS.


I have checked out the Hutchbook at Hutchbook .com and I'm kind of getting the hang at navigating it (Thanks Leon), Under the little square that indicates Rarity, some of those boxes are blank and I can not find an explanation for the blank block. So R=rare S= scarce and C=common. Does anyone know what the blank box means????????? I found two that have a blank box under rating. One is WELLER BOTTLING WORKS SARATOGA SPRINGS N.Y. The Hutchbook # NY1193 and the other is a long label CHICAGO CONSOLIDATED BOTTLING CO It has a long label and gives the address and has a date of 1902 embossed on it. The Hutchbook # IL0187. Its a very cool bottle. so I have dug 7 rare, 4 scarce and 3 common ones so far listed in the Hutchbook.


So another Question I have is how do you clean them if they still have that weird stopper in them and are they worth more if the stopper is in them???? and speaking of worth. Are they worth any thing?? I know that a bottle is only worth what you can get for it. But is there a market for rare and scarce hutches???? I have been checking out some of the bottle auctions and e bay and some of the other sites that sell bottles and it looks like on average a hutch goes for about 25.00 to 37.00 dollars but some I watched an action by crick digger that had a couple of hutches that were rated as rare or scarce go for 60.00 to 75.00. Is there a market for hutches?????


Another question is about the slick rick's I have found. Has any one ever seen a Hutch with a paper label?? I have also found a lot of slick rick crown tops all have an oval where embossing usually goes. All of the slick rick hutches have on the bottom THE LEQUID. Some in a diamond others do not. Any one know what that means??????


Okay here a few pics from the latest dig. I did not bring the camera, I forgot it so these are after the fact. Thanks for all your knowledge people.


The first pic is the CHICAGO CONSOLITATED BOTTLING CO 14 TO 18 LOMAX PLACE CHICAGO ILLS. 1902 The next two pics are of two hutches listed as rare in the hutch book. They are PIKEVILLE BOTTLING WORKS PIKEVILLE KY and AUXIER BOTTLING CO PIKEVILLE KY. And then a pic some of the hutches together then a pic of the WELLER BOTTLING WORKS SARATOGA SPRINGS N. Y. that has a blank box on the rarity ratings.View attachment 239971View attachment 239972View attachment 239973View attachment 239974View attachment 239975
WOW! Now that is what I call a bottle collection. Nice
 

HotDiggerDog

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Quite the collection! --Behold greatness. He has a Charger (Yes, with a hemi), digs every chance he gets, + a heart of gold. --Has my vote in Nov. :cool: Note: We have a lot of such quality members and really should have our own political party. (What would we call it? Hmmm.)
My brother has end of the line charger + 2 hemi engines in crates. Thank goodness for older brothers!
 

eddeeeddee

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Interesting that you're finding so many blank Hutches. Those were typically only used by companies which were early adopters of the style in their area so they weren't worried about their competitors stealing them, or companies which couldn't afford to have their own bottles embossed. I'm even more confident now that you're digging the dump of a bottler which was buying bottles second hand from other companies. You wouldn't typically expect to find Hutchinsons from Kentucky, New York, and Illinois in the same dump - especially not a dump in West Virginia. These were pretty much never distributed very far outside the city where the bottler was located.
You would expect to find a mix like that at a glass company dump as well, but I've never heard of any glasshouses which only made soda bottles. The coal would make sense for a bottler if they were using it to power their machinery, and a bottling plant was an industrial operation so the machinery parts make sense as well. The slag glass I'm not sure about - maybe threw trash into the furnace?
Unless you live in a very unpopulated part of West Virginia, there was probably a bottling plant at some point in your general vicinity. You might need to go digging deep in the archives to find records of it though, especially if they never used any bottles embossed with their own name. Sometimes the dump wouldn't be right by the operation either. I was once digging a dump which was clearly used almost exclusively by one downtown hotel, but it was in a bizarre spot that would have been outside the city limits in those days and quite far from any roads.
This whole area was very industrialized from about 1875 to about 1925 due to all the coal production here. It was the primary coal source for the USA during that time period. Most of the towns were along the New River and this place is about 2 miles a way form there as the crow flies. A lot of the towns no longer exists and The new river gorge has town after town now that are only foundations. Its a National park these days so no way to dig there. So the more I dig the more if find things that make me think Glass Manufacturing plant. I have hit a large cash of rail road track. Heavy duty iron track at that. I managed to get underneath it and found a good deposit of good bottles. So three slicks that are hutches and three slicks that are crown tops but I found them unusual as they have a hard time standing. There bases are very small almost like a torpedo and a hutch combined themselves. Not a good bottle design they fall over very easily. So these bottles where all together. There were 8 of them but only three were whole. each are made a bit differently one is machine made and on the bottom has C. G. Co. 1008D, The other two have an applied top at least the seam goes only to the crown and it look like the crown has been welded on. The bottom of them have an A 661 and the other one has R3 These bottles where all laying next to each other. Also found two hutches with names. The Queen City Bottling works and The other is Crown Bottling Works Lee j. Taylor Propr. New Bern N C Then found a good Coca Cola from Charleston Bottling works. so here a pic
of the slick hutches and the three slick crowns.
so I have found other bottles some small what looks like extract bottles but no maker marks. I have found a bunch of them. Some are rectangular other are square. Then I have found a lot of what looks like drinking glasses, all are broken or cracked. And I found a perfect White Crown Mason that had a coin in it that I can't make out and a very incrusted pocket watch in it.
 

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hemihampton

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Do you have a pic of the Coke? I remember taking a scenic old Train Ride through West Virginia about 10 or 15 Years ago, a Tourist Attraction type thing, maybe near Buchanon? BUT, I noticed it was a good way to see old Foundations in the Woods that were impossible to see from the Roads. LEON.
 

CanadianBottles

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This whole area was very industrialized from about 1875 to about 1925 due to all the coal production here. It was the primary coal source for the USA during that time period. Most of the towns were along the New River and this place is about 2 miles a way form there as the crow flies. A lot of the towns no longer exists and The new river gorge has town after town now that are only foundations. Its a National park these days so no way to dig there. So the more I dig the more if find things that make me think Glass Manufacturing plant. I have hit a large cash of rail road track. Heavy duty iron track at that. I managed to get underneath it and found a good deposit of good bottles. So three slicks that are hutches and three slicks that are crown tops but I found them unusual as they have a hard time standing. There bases are very small almost like a torpedo and a hutch combined themselves. Not a good bottle design they fall over very easily. So these bottles where all together. There were 8 of them but only three were whole. each are made a bit differently one is machine made and on the bottom has C. G. Co. 1008D, The other two have an applied top at least the seam goes only to the crown and it look like the crown has been welded on. The bottom of them have an A 661 and the other one has R3 These bottles where all laying next to each other. Also found two hutches with names. The Queen City Bottling works and The other is Crown Bottling Works Lee j. Taylor Propr. New Bern N C Then found a good Coca Cola from Charleston Bottling works. so here a pic
of the slick hutches and the three slick crowns.
so I have found other bottles some small what looks like extract bottles but no maker marks. I have found a bunch of them. Some are rectangular other are square. Then I have found a lot of what looks like drinking glasses, all are broken or cracked. And I found a perfect White Crown Mason that had a coin in it that I can't make out and a very incrusted pocket watch in it.
Those semi-round-bottom bottles are ginger ales, they were meant to be held in the wire holders used for true round-bottoms but didn't have to be if you didn't have any on hand. The two on the left look to me like they were made in the UK, not the US. They were mostly a UK design to begin with and as far as I can see they have applied crown tops, which was fairly unusual for North American glassmakers but quite common in the UK where they were still making applied crowns much later. The one on the right could be American, it doesn't look like the imported ginger ales that I've seen. I think it's extremely unlikely that the two on the left were made in the US though.

Also if the area was heavily industrialized then it definitely had bottling plants, probably several. You rarely got a significant mining town without at least one soda bottler, even in places far more remote than West Virginia. Even the Yukon had a couple bottlers who used Hutchinsons.
 

nhpharm

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This looks to me like a bottling works dump. When bottles were returned to a bottling works, often bottles from other bottlers got mixed in, and of course the bottler for the most part wasn't interested in re-using someone else's bottles, so they would throw them out. You are lucky as typically my experience is that they broke them before tossing the, so finding all these whole ones is pretty special.
 

eddeeeddee

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Do you have a pic of the Coke? I remember taking a scenic old Train Ride through West Virginia about 10 or 15 Years ago, a Tourist Attraction type thing, maybe near Buchanon? BUT, I noticed it was a good way to see old Foundations in the Woods that were impossible to see from the Roads. LEON.
Yes I have a pic of the coke. The bottle says Coca Cola under that TRADEMARK REGISTERED At the Base CHARELSTON BOTTLING WORKS. On the other side it has the coca cola thing like the front, but on the base it says CONTENTS 6 1/2 FLUID OUNCES. On the heel D.O.C. 1183. On the Bottom Coca Cola.
So they have several trains that ride through the woods. You maybe took the Potomac Eagle Scenic Railroad. That is the most poplar one. There is also an Amtrak you can take through the New River Gorge that goes through ghost town after ghost town. There are about 20 of them in the gorge. Nothing left of them but old foundation and you can't really see any thing in the summer time because of all the foliage,
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eddeeeddee

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Hello all you wonderful bottle people. Well it day 3 of digging this old Bottle Manufacturing plant. So far I have found 22 Hutch bottles that are whole. I have found 7 crown tops that are whole and 8 billion crown tops with broken tops. I'm amazed that I'm finding so many whole hutch bottles so I'm thinking that they tossed all those bottles because they where no longer in use. Lots of labels Digging as slowed down because I'm up against some very large pieces of iron. So I'm thinking a new approach and start digging to the left on the other side of the old stump. The soil is very compact It takes almost an hour to remove one bottle. Okay now that I have all these bottles I have QUESTIONS AND MORE QUESTIONS.


I have checked out the Hutchbook at Hutchbook .com and I'm kind of getting the hang at navigating it (Thanks Leon), Under the little square that indicates Rarity, some of those boxes are blank and I can not find an explanation for the blank block. So R=rare S= scarce and C=common. Does anyone know what the blank box means????????? I found two that have a blank box under rating. One is WELLER BOTTLING WORKS SARATOGA SPRINGS N.Y. The Hutchbook # NY1193 and the other is a long label CHICAGO CONSOLIDATED BOTTLING CO It has a long label and gives the address and has a date of 1902 embossed on it. The Hutchbook # IL0187. Its a very cool bottle. so I have dug 7 rare, 4 scarce and 3 common ones so far listed in the Hutchbook.


So another Question I have is how do you clean them if they still have that weird stopper in them and are they worth more if the stopper is in them???? and speaking of worth. Are they worth any thing?? I know that a bottle is only worth what you can get for it. But is there a market for rare and scarce hutches???? I have been checking out some of the bottle auctions and e bay and some of the other sites that sell bottles and it looks like on average a hutch goes for about 25.00 to 37.00 dollars but some I watched an action by crick digger that had a couple of hutches that were rated as rare or scarce go for 60.00 to 75.00. Is there a market for hutches?????


Another question is about the slick rick's I have found. Has any one ever seen a Hutch with a paper label?? I have also found a lot of slick rick crown tops all have an oval where embossing usually goes. All of the slick rick hutches have on the bottom THE LEQUID. Some in a diamond others do not. Any one know what that means??????


Okay here a few pics from the latest dig. I did not bring the camera, I forgot it so these are after the fact. Thanks for all your knowledge people.


The first pic is the CHICAGO CONSOLITATED BOTTLING CO 14 TO 18 LOMAX PLACE CHICAGO ILLS. 1902 The next two pics are of two hutches listed as rare in the hutch book. They are PIKEVILLE BOTTLING WORKS PIKEVILLE KY and AUXIER BOTTLING CO PIKEVILLE KY. And then a pic some of the hutches together then a pic of the WELLER BOTTLING WORKS SARATOGA SPRINGS N. Y. that has a blank box on the rarity ratings.View attachment 239971View attachment 239972View attachment 239973View attachment 239974View attachment 239975

Hello wonderful bottle people. How all y'all doin ?? Just an update from the bottle mine. So went out digging on Monday and Wednesday. Monday sucked, So I found my self up against a bunch of rail road track and that's pretty much impossible to dig through. I Only found three slick rick soda bottles with nothing on them at all and so I decided to start working on the opposite side of the hole where there is like a bulge . So got to work on that and as soon as I started to clear all the poison ivy and Asian bitter sweet vines and roses bushes it starts to rain and not a little rain but down pores So now I find my self in a big mud puddle. I hate diggin in the rain, So Monday was feeling a bit defeated.


Wednesday I got out there early with a new shovel too. Started clearing the dirt away and started pulling rust junks like old tin can's and I started to uncover layers. It was kind of interesting. The top layer I pulled out some house hold bottles and broken plates The Top layer is about a foot down and goes for about 3 feet. I uncover two Nehi soda bottle Nice art deco ones and a skirt Coca Cola . Most are clear and smooth machine made. Found some medicine bottles. I found a Dr Miles Nervine and a large bottle Cardui The Women's Tonic. Chattanooga Medicine Co. All of these household bottles and what not are about 3 feet down then there about a foot of clay and under that is the soda bottle Layer. So its just broken soda's and hutches. So as I dug in this area I cam across a hollow spot where maybe a gallon bucket was but the metal has basically all denigrated leaving this hollow spot and its packed full of crown tops that are not broken. There are about 8 what I guess are called round flask. They're slick but have writing all different on there bottoms. These bottles have very small bases and do not stand up well. So I was told they were ginger ale bottles and they were meant to be held. One has R 3 and has applied top then there is one with an A 661 another applied top then there was a machine made one that had DW Co on the bottom. Then there was a Vance's Ginger Ale Detroit Mich bottle in that bunch. Also Eagle Bottling Works Cincinnati Ohio. A couple of East Side Bottling Works Detroit Mich. A coca cola from Charleston Bottling works W. Va. Then some other applied top crown bottles that have nothing on them at all. Then there Hutches. 5 slicks, 5 T.C. FOX BOTTLER KNOXVILLE TENN . Then found several more PRINCETON BOTTLING AND ICE PLANT PRINCETON W.VA. Hutch book # WV0169 considered rare. Also a couple more ALLEGAHANY BOTTLING CO GLEN JEAN W.V. Hutch # WV0072 considered rare. Then found two new ones CROWN BOTTLING WORKS LEE J. TAYLOR PROPR. NEW BERN N.C, The hutch number is NC0037 and it considered rare. Then I found a THE QUEEN CITY BOTTLING WORKS with a monogram of WH. This hutch has no rating but the hutch # is OH0191 Then in the middle of it all found a perfect WHETE CROWN MASON quart Jar. blue in color and it contained a very corroded pocket watch and a coin that I can not make out


So over all a very good day. It was getting dark and there plenty more left in that layer. Very exciting so I'll be back on Saturday to dig more of that section.


So I have a Question I keep finding all the hutches listed as Rare. Rare in the Hutch book is defined as 10 or less. If I keep finding like 20 of some of these rare ones will they no longer be considered rare???

Some of the pics of the days digs the first was a Coke cola and a Nehi found in the upper layer and a slick rick bottle of some sort. The second pic is an assortment of clear house hold bottles and a The third is the three round flasks that I guess held Ginger Ale. The 4th are some of the medicine bottles I found. The 5th is the White Crown Mason another round flask, a soda that is from the Loop Creek Bottling and Ice cream Co a Welches grape juice and another bottle that has writing on the bottom but can't make out, It has an applied top. The 6th is two new hutches The queen City bottling works and The Crown Bottling Works and another Princeton Bottling and Ice Co. (makes 5 of them now) Then a queen city bottling works crown top and a Vance's Ginger ale and one of the East side Bottling works and an Eagle Bottling works. The 7th Is the Coca Cola from Charleston Bottling works a crown top. Then 2 hutch's from T.C. Fox Bottler Then a crown top from West Virginia Beverage co Lymola from Charleston WV then the next is Loop Creek Bottling Co. So I know this bottle is at leas 1916 because Loop Creek Bottling and Ice Cream Company changed there name to Loop Creek Bottling Co. at that time The two bottom one are hutches another T C fox and a another Princeton Bottling and Ice company Okay all Until next time keep digging. Can you dig it?
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