Dug first pontil pit of the year.......

[kleinkaliber]

Nice! I would dig ten feet for those finds with no second thoughts! Love the dog. Digging a 10-12 footer is tough work. Makes me wonder how the guys that dig those 30 footers do it.

 

[cannibalfromhannibal]

Thanks Klein, and I'm with ya. Whenever I find a stone liner, I'm always full of anticipation. I'm usually most disgruntled the few days afterwards when I'm hobbling about half crippled from the dig. Now that I'm feeling back to normal (whatever THAT is), I am very pleased with my finds. I remember this old fellow I used to dig with at the old city dump where I grew up, who told me he would dig for 2 weeks at a time at an old stage stop before finding a bottle! Now THAT'S dedication! Later one of his sons actually bought a ghost town in Nevada to dig for the bottles! I think some of their insanity rubbed off on my young impressionable mind. But I do look with amazement on those 30 footers being dug east of me! Inconceivable! Jack

 

[Bass Assassin]

Jack, I don't mean to hijack your thread so please forgive me for asking the following. This subject brings up a question I've been wanting to ask. I have 2 holes about 7 feet apart. In the top of one hole, about 3-4 feet down I hit a layer of broken brick, and very little broken glass, and a broken pot lid that dates 1848-1852. I kept digging and at 10 feet I stopped, dug a 2-3 hole in the center and probed with a 5ft probe and felt nothing. Just dirt. But the probe sank with no problem. I found no whole glass or even broken glass in a 7 ft range. In the other hole , I found a mixture of newer(early 1900's) broken glass in the top 4 ft, with brick. Then a 2-3 foot space of nothing. At about 7 feet I found 2 BIM snuff jars in 1 corner. I dug another 3 feet and nothing. No glass or brick in these void areas, only dirt . Then I found an umbrella ink in the same corner I found the snuff jars. The ink was buried in the corner with the top facing the center of the hole , only the top was broken off. I suspected this hole had been dipped and at this point I was about 12-14 feet deep. Again, as in the previous hole, I dug a 2-3 ft small hole in the center and stuck my rod all the way to the handle and felt nothing, I made about 10 different probes in all directions, and felt nothing. ... Now I know what everyone is thinking, that I stopped too soon. But, I was by myself and moving that much dirt was very difficult. Both holes were apprx 5'x4' rectangular. The ground here is red clay so it's very easy to discern the walls of the pits. Problem is, this stuff caves in easily. The pits are located on the property of what was the village doctor who lived there from approximately 1850-1885. Then I heard the home was turned into a birding house. My questions are:
1. Why would there be 2 pits that deep on a single dwelling property? I'm estimating they are at least 18 ft, and possibly deeper.
2. Could these holes have been dipped at some point? This location is in a very rural area and I can't understand why they would in fact dip them when they could just dig another hole. If they were dipped, how deep could the dippers go? Wouldn't there likely be glass in the bottom? This has caused me sleepless nights! I want to hear everyone's thoughts.

 

[Bass Assassin]

Sorry, typo.. The home was turned into a "boarding house", not birding house.

 

[cannibalfromhannibal]

Gee, I was trying to imagine a birding house and all the bird bitters bottles to be found! But to your very good questions, I find my questions are usually answered with more questions! Firstly, I think you did the right thing, being a primarily solo digger. Whenever I hear myself saying what you wrote, ("collapses easily", "moving all that dirt by myself"= exhaustion=mistakes=possible tragedy), it is usually time for me to reconsider just what I am doing for what, or weighing out the risk/reward potentials. Whenever I get more than 8' deep solo I really have to stay super aware and able to recognize potential issues before they become hazards. Back to your holes of mystery, you didn't mention if you had different layers of anything like ash or other man made substances. I occasionally find ash pits right next to the privy used to exclusively dump from the stove & fireplace. They must have gone through cords daily and had to do something with the ashes. Your holes sound like some of the rectangular early cisterns around here but they are brick lined. Wondering if your clay was nonporous enough to hold water? I have dug one, (and only one) clay cistern with similar results as you. I have no answer for your first question unless they turn out to be 30 footers. Regardless, I would walk away from that one unless you start loosing sleep. Then I'd get a 4-5 man crew together with a winch to "get to the bottom'' of the mystery. Personally I would have to think there are easier places to hunt, but I know how frustrating it can be to find the hole and then that happens. I dug a similar hole same distance from the stone liner I just dug and similar results. Got to 4' level with only ashes and probed and hit bottom at 8' and no apparent use layer at all. I've been considering going back and getting to the bottom as I know there might be 1-2 hiding in the bottom corners. I have probed some holes and swear there was nothing but I dug anyway because I had no better prospects and sure enough I would hit a layer near the bottom! Blows my mind each time it happens. It's like the magician's sword trick, shoving the sword into the box and the pretty assistant steps out unscathed. How can it miss? So I remind myself the probe is simply another tool on the belt and only true way of knowing is to dig it out. WHEW! Second question I think is the easier. If it is rural today, it was super rural 160 years ago, so no way was it dipped in my opinion for the reasons you stated. But for the same reasons, I would suspect a ravine or other less interfering place to dump the trash than the privy. I used to think privy trash was a city thing because I never dug a country privy with anything, until I did. That said, I don't think it was a commonplace thing to do in the country as in the towns and cities as they didn't have as many options (ravines). I would try to probe the most likely areas for a privy as there should be a later one or two somewhere. That's what I keep telling myself about the yard with the stone liner I just dug......now THAT keeps me awake at night. Hope this helps? jack

 

[Bass Assassin]

Yes, it does help Jack. In both holes, there was ashy layers in the top 4 ft. I felt like it was getting too dangerous and like you stated, I had to ask myself was it worth it? The answer is no. There could could glass deeper but it won't be dug by me. I think the holes are much too dangerous. And who knows, these holes could be 25-30 feet. They could also be abandoned wells.

 

[cannibalfromhannibal]

I thought of the well possibility, but without stone liners and being the size & shape you mentioned I discounted that idea as highly unlikely. I'm guessing ash pits, but mighty deep for that purpose. While not as effective as lime, I am sure they used ashes in the privies to knock down the stink as well as to do something with the abundance of ashes. Just my thoughts. I suspect there is a stone or brick liner somewhere on that property.......Jack

 

[Bass Assassin]

There is a brick lined well on the property about 30 ft away. I guess the biggest mystery to me is why the pot lid dated between 1848-1852 was found in the 1st 4 ft of one of the holes. I haven't run across any stone or brick lined privies in my area thus far. Thanks for your advice.

 

[cannibalfromhannibal]

I keep forgetting you're in the deep south.......as for the potlid, it could have been a late throw, would be my guess. I have found the odd stuff in ash pits before. Usually kitchen related stuff, not cosmetic, so still a mystery. Ya gotta love it!