Lines on a bottle, flaw or not?

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hemihampton

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sandchip

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They are what I call "gather lines". You'll notice on many examples that they run generally in a spiral from bottom to top and, albeit rarely, on good a example, you can see where it starts on the bottom of the bottle, which would be where the apprentice/assistant clipped the glass as the gaffer withdrew the blowpipe from the batch. When the blowpipe is inserted into the batch of molten glass, it is rotated to accumulate the desired amount of glass on the blowpipe, which is then rolled on the marver to make the gather more uniform before inserting into the mold. Some subtle change in the glass occurs during these stages that slightly changes the hardness of the glass in these areas, which sometimes becomes more pronounced after years of exposure to chemicals in the soil. I've heard them called "ground lines" but I've seen them on many, many bottles that were never buried. Hope this helps.
 

Chelvis

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They are what I call "gather lines". You'll notice on many examples that they run generally in a spiral from bottom to top and, albeit rarely, on good a example, you can see where it starts on the bottom of the bottle, which would be where the apprentice/assistant clipped the glass as the gaffer withdrew the blowpipe from the batch. When the blowpipe is inserted into the batch of molten glass, it is rotated to accumulate the desired amount of glass on the blowpipe, which is then rolled on the marver to make the gather more uniform before inserting into the mold. Some subtle change in the glass occurs during these stages that slightly changes the hardness of the glass in these areas, which sometimes becomes more pronounced after years of exposure to chemicals in the soil. I've heard them called "ground lines" but I've seen them on many, many bottles that were never buried. Hope this helps.
Sandchip,
This appears to be the best explanation so far. It looks like it starts from the bottom on my bottle, as well. Gather lines, or ground lines is a much more appropriate name. It makes more sense than Straw lines. Thank you!
 

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sandchip

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Here's one that I found in an attic years ago, obviously never in the ground. The chemicals in the soil may cause them to become more pronounced over time, but have nothing to do with their formation, which is why I'm not particularly fond of the term "ground lines," since it may be misleading to some collectors.

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SandiR

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Thank you. I haven't seen this before. Is it a common thing? Is there a name for it other than swirly lines caused during manufacturing?:)
It's pretty common - I suspect it comes from the glass and the mould being different temperatures. Some moulds also had a paste put in them and that might have affected the glass. I hope you know that "metal" means molten glass in this situation.
 

Old man digger

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I've really only seen these marks on Buried Bottles & I've dug hundreds & hundreds of Buried Bottles in Privy's. It's actually kinda common to find these marks on buried Bottles in my opinion. But if it could of been there before buried? That's possibly but I think unlikely from my experience. LEON.
I've really only seen these marks on Buried Bottles & I've dug hundreds & hundreds of Buried Bottles in Privy's. It's actually kinda common to find these marks on buried Bottles in my opinion. But if it could of been there before buried? That's possibly but I think unlikely from my experience. LEON.
I AGREE WITH THE PRIVY THEORY. HUMAN WASTE CONTAINS MANY MINERALS AND ACIDS...
 

Johnny M

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I AGREE WITH THE PRIVY THEORY. HUMAN WASTE CONTAINS MANY MINERALS AND ACIDS...
I agree with LEON. I think water seepage over time creates hair thick wavy canals or wormy little micro channels where the bottle touches its underground environment that once established continue to allow guided moisture seepage from ash and dump soils that actually eat at the silicate in the glass and impart surface flaws that mirror these hair thick drainage mazes. Maybe I'm crazy but I have dug badly sick bottles from moist ashy layers and the surface swirling is present on too many finds to have been in the many types of bottles glass to begin with . Sodas, medicines, squares , clear, amber aqua or whatever in some dumps it doesn't seem to matter. It's like the coal ash juice or soil minerals maybe creates a weak acid and being buried 100 plus years allows it to do its work just like it creates clouds and heavy flaky sick glass in general.
 

sandchip

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It's pretty common - I suspect it comes from the glass and the mould being different temperatures. Some moulds also had a paste put in them and that might have affected the glass. I hope you know that "metal" means molten glass in this situation.
The lines are formed before insertion into the mold. Paste was used on turn mold bottles, which obliterated any gather lines.
 

sandchip

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I AGREE WITH THE PRIVY THEORY. HUMAN WASTE CONTAINS MANY MINERALS AND ACIDS...
Please notice the attic found, labeled example in post no. 14. Also, see post no. 12. There are many examples exhibiting gather lines that have never been in the ground.
 

sandchip

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I agree with LEON. I think water seepage over time creates hair thick wavy canals or wormy little micro channels where the bottle touches its underground environment that once established continue to allow guided moisture seepage from ash and dump soils that actually eat at the silicate in the glass and impart surface flaws that mirror these hair thick drainage mazes. Maybe I'm crazy but I have dug badly sick bottles from moist ashy layers and the surface swirling is present on too many finds to have been in the many types of bottles glass to begin with . Sodas, medicines, squares , clear, amber aqua or whatever in some dumps it doesn't seem to matter. It's like the coal ash juice or soil minerals maybe creates a weak acid and being buried 100 plus years allows it to do its work just like it creates clouds and heavy flaky sick glass in general.
Please notice the attic found, labeled example in post no. 14. Also, see post no. 12. There are many examples exhibiting gather lines that have never been in the ground.
 

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