RARE SODA BOTTLE BOOK ~ By J. L. JONES ~ COPYRIGHT 1972

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morbious_fod

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Here's one for you Tennessee boys ...

Big Victory Chief ~ Morristown, Tennessee ~ 1935

Were these being made in 1935 or is the date a misread/misprint/typo?

I collect Big Chief's and have been wanting one of these for a long time but haven't been willing to pay the big bucks they usually demand. Too bad I didn't nab one back in 1972 for $2.00-$3.00

Bob

Bottle B-17





FE413827A4B247D78FE29E3D44985541.jpg

My personal opinion is that this is not a 1935 acl. My reasoning is that many early acls don't usually have neck labels, I'm guessing that this was a much more difficult process until around 1938 or 39.

Also it helps to check out when the bottler started.

Dixie Bottling Company Morristown Tennessee incorporated on June 12, 1945-Public Acts of the State of Tennessee 1947

It is not an early acl, which makes two acls the author, and his contributors, have gotten wrong.
 

SODAPOPBOB

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Morb ~

Thanks for the specifics regarding the Dixie bottling company. That's the kind of information needed to help set the record straight. But not only does it draw into question some of the information contained in the J.L. Jones book, it also places a big question mark on the information from the gono.com website that collectors and forum members have been accessing and quoting from for years. Maybe soda bottle collecting isn't as advanced these days as we would like to think it is and in some respects we are still finding our way in the dark. With so few copies of the J.L. Jones book available and in the hands of collectors today, it can almost be thought of as a nonexistent resource when it comes to researching soda bottles, especially values. And now I wonder about the reliability of gono.com. If it were closely scrutinized I wonder how many errors it too might contain?

~ * ~

I think this is as good time as any to reiterate it is not I who listed the 1935 Big Victory Chief bottle in the J.L. Jones book, nor I that listed the 1934 date on the gono.com website; not to mention other topics I bring up. But when I do discover such things, then I see no reason not take a closer look at them. And this sort of thing is going to continue with me - so if I find something related to the hobby of soda bottle collecting I consider interesting, no matter how controversial it might be, I'm going to follow that lead and see where it takes me. If there are those among us who feel I believe everything I read, then this very statement should set the record straight in that I don't. I am openly stating I now stand corrected regarding the production date(s) for the Big Victory Chief acl from Morristown, Tennessee - but not because of popular opinion, but because forum member Morbious_fod presented substantiating information to refute the 1934 and 1935 dates.

To those who choose to focus their attentions on finding faults with the 1972 J. L. Jones book, I suggest you focus some of that attention on the 2013 gono.com website.

Respectfully

Bob
 

SODAPOPBOB

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ORIGINAL: epackage

My guess is that the Big Chief had a 5. on the base that was misinterpreted as a 1935 and not the 1945 that it actually was. The Owens date codes surely were not as widely known and easily deciphered as it is in the internet age...


Jim ~

I now agree with what you brought to our attention above. Except now, because of Morb having established the correct dates for the Dixie Bottling Company of Morristown, Tennessee, you/I/we will no longer have to "guess" about whether the date codes were misinterpreted.

Thanks for the contribution

Bob
 

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The following is primarily for the new members among us who are wondering about my having mentioned a "Jumbo Cola" as being the earliest applied color label (acl) soda bottle currently known. This goes back a couple of years which involved a thread I started regarding a search for the earliest acl. The long story short of it is, member Morbious_fod presented a soda bottle he provided accompanying information with to confirm that the "Jumbo Cola" was in fact first produced in 1934, thus establishing it as the earliest acl known. The following five pictures are what established this previously unfamiliar bottle ...

[ Front ]





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Base ...



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Patent ...



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Kingsport, West Virginia newspaper article ~ September 20, 1934



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SODAPOPBOB

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Newspaper ad ~ September 21, 1934 ...

Notice the "Coupon Not Good After October 1, 1934" at the bottom of the ad.

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SODAPOPBOB

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Morb ~

Here's something I never mentioned before and would like to bring to your attention now. Please scroll to Page 434of the following 2010 pdf article by Bill Lockart of the Bottle Research Group (BRG). Notice where it says ...

"An unpublished study conducted by Bob Brown never found a single ACL bottle with a 1934 date code"

I submitted this information to Bill Lockhart after member Wonkapete submitted his 1935 7up bottle to my earliest acl thread, and at which time I thought the thread was over and done with. It wasn't until sometime later that you submitted your 1934 "Jumbo - A Super Cola" bottle. Immediately following your "Jumbo Cola" contribution, I sent the information to Bill Lockhart who assured me that at some point he was going to correct my earlier submission about the 1935 7up. But I guess Bill never got around to it. In any event, I wanted both you and Wonkapete to know that I clearly pointed out to Bill on both occasions that it was not I who found the 1935 7up nor the 1934 Jumbo Cola, but that it was you and Wonkapete who had found them. Bill's response to this in an email to me was that what mattered to him wasn't so much who "found" the information but rather who "provided" him with it. He added that history/research is full of people who obtained information based on what others before them had found originally, and that my contribution was no different - since I was the one who brought it to his attention that I was the one he intended to give the credit to.

Anyway, I just wanted both you and Wonkapete to know I tried to give you guys the credit but failed.

Sincerely,

Bob

[ Please scroll to Page 434 ]

http://www.sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/EPChap10b.pdf
 

morbious_fod

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Morb ~

Thanks for the specifics regarding the Dixie bottling company. That's the kind of information needed to help set the record straight. But not only does it draw into question some of the information contained in the J.L. Jones book, it also places a big question mark on the information from the gono.com website that collectors and forum members have been accessing and quoting from for years. Maybe soda bottle collecting isn't as advanced these days as we would like to think it is and in some respects we are still finding our way in the dark. With so few copies of the J.L. Jones book available and in the hands of collectors today, it can almost be thought of as a nonexistent resource when it comes to researching soda bottles, especially values. And now I wonder about the reliability of gono.com. If it were closely scrutinized I wonder how many errors it too might contain?

~ * ~

I think this is as good time as any to reiterate it is not I who listed the 1935 Big Victory Chief bottle in the J.L. Jones book, nor I that listed the 1934 date on the gono.com website; not to mention other topics I bring up. But when I do discover such things, then I see no reason not take a closer look at them. And this sort of thing is going to continue with me - so if I find something related to the hobby of soda bottle collecting I consider interesting, no matter how controversial it might be, I'm going to follow that lead and see where it takes me. If there are those among us who feel I believe everything I read, then this very statement should set the record straight in that I don't. I am openly stating I now stand corrected regarding the production date(s) for the Big Victory Chief acl from Morristown, Tennessee - but not because of popular opinion, but because forum member Morbious_fod presented substantiating information to refute the 1934 and 1935 dates.

To those who choose to focus their attentions on finding faults with the 1972 J. L. Jones book, I suggest you focus some of that attention on the 2013 gono.com website.


Bob


First off I was only addressing what I saw as a mistake, and pointing out that these ended up being two mistakes on Jones' part. Not a personal attack on you, or Mr. Jones for that matter. Just pointing out that the man made other mistakes in his book, so it is possible with his calling the Augusta Coke a Hutchinson, that maybe he didn't realize that it was modified.

As for Gono.com, it is clear that they got some of their information, but certainly not all, from this book. That being said, you may notice that I don't quote Gono.com, but I do use it as a resource, usually these days for cans more than bottles; however, like every resource you can't just take it at face value and run with it like it is fact.

I only responded to what sounded like an invitation to discuss the Big Victory Chief, after seeing that the same was done for the Crown bottle. Not a "Tennessee Boy" really, but I do dabble in its soda history.
 

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