Black glass pontil or not???

olddump · Feb 16, 2004

I dug this yesterday and it's really nice but the bottom has me puzzled. The bottle is a three peice mold and very heavy glass with a huge two inch indent and at the top of this is a flat area with six small bumps in a circle. It is olive green black glass. Anyone know of a type of pontil like this? It is also ten inches tall.

olddump · Feb 16, 2004

another pic

Harry Pristis · Feb 16, 2004

Hello, Branigan . . .

I don't recognize this base finish, nor can I say whether or not there is a pontil scar. Is there a scar -- something that will shred your fingernail?

Pontil scar or no, this may be simply an elaborate post-bottom mold used in conjunction with the three-piece mold, rather than a tool mark.

I can tell you, for what it is worth, that there is a separate tool (and the name escapes me now) that was used to push up the base of a blown bottle. Here is an example of a square profile tool used before the pontil was attached. The second image is of a toothed profile tool used to push up the bottom. Both bottles are Continental onions.

-------Harry Pristis

Harry Pristis · Feb 16, 2004

And I have seen other variations of this tool-mark.

----Harry Pristis

olddump · Feb 16, 2004

Thank you. Yes that sound very reasonable to me. No there is no scar on the bottom but just inside of the lip under the ring there is a seam where the ring and top of the neck were added. It sounds as your right because it's too uniform not to have been. Do you have any approxamite time frame for this. I have been digging this dump for three years now and it seems to be getting older latley. From 80s and 90s to some improved pontils and three part molds. Thank again. Tom Olddump

Harry Pristis · Feb 17, 2004

Hey, Tom . . .

You haven't shown us the lip of this bottle. The lip may be more important than the base for dating the bottle.

Where do you dig?

--------Harry Pristis

olddump · Feb 17, 2004

In southern New Jersey the spot is in walking distance from my house and I've been digging it for over three years lucky huh. I don't know how to combine my photos as yet and was asked to try[by admin.] So i hesitate to put too many on but i want to know about this so here it is. The town [Cape May] is an old town and this dump is huge. So my intrest is to see if I'm going in the right direction. Thanks much. Tom

Harry Pristis · Feb 26, 2004

Hello, Tom...

I missed your last post somehow. Your bottle does have a 1870s-80s look, but that seems to be an odd bottle you have there. But, maybe it just seems odd because all I have seen are partial images. It has a wine lip, it has a prominent kickup, it's probably a wine bottle.

That wine lip is not at all common on American bottles, in my limited experience. Rex Wilson in his book, BOTTLES ON THE WESTERN FRONTIER, doesn't even figure a lip-type like this (closest is the bevelled champagne lip). I am guessing that your bottle is Continental in origin. Wish I knew for sure.

I do have one American bottle with this type of lip, and it is not a wine bottle. It is on a bottle which is base-embossed GOLDEN'S LIQUID BEEF TONIC / N. CRITTENTON / PROP / N Y.

Here is what mine looks like, for what it's worth.

------------Harry Pristis

IRISH · Feb 27, 2004

Nice colour bottle Harry, those wine lips are very common on Australian beer bottles we call them ring seals here.
Branigan, I'd agree that it's an 1870s-80s wine or stout bottle.

olddump · Mar 1, 2004

Thanks guys you are a big help to me and others here. It's not as old as i had thought so I imagine the whole dump is from that era but i have also been getting a lot of three peice mold seam bottles there too. Thanks again and keep up the good work it's great.

Tom, Olddump

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