EARLIEST "CROWN TOP" SODA BOTTLES 1892 - 1900

[cyberdigger]

I'm not the violent type, but that probably is enough about the banks on this thread.. [&:]

 

[ncbred]

ORIGINAL: celerycola

Punch-i-Nello label

Thanks for that! Did any other town bottle Punch I Nello besides Goldsboro, NC?

 

[coboltmoon]

Hello Sam, I am glad I got to see your Moxie collection when it was complete, very impressive.
A couple things I would like to add about the crowntop. Somewhere I read that the crowntop was invented in France in the late 1880’s and was patented in the US later by completely different company apparently a somewhat common practice in the day. So France may have the oldest crown top.
I did just pick up a Moxie nerve food crown top that is often seen with a blob. I will try to get a pick up soon.

 

[Sodasandbeers]

Baltimore is a good study for early crown top bottles; both beer and soda bottle. In Baltimore, many of the large breweries consolidated into a beer trust in 1899 (Maryland Brewing Co.) and another in 1900 (Gottlieb Bauernschmidt Straus Brewing Co). So any crown top bottles for the brewies that formed the Maryland Brewing Co. date 1892-1899. and any from the Maryland Brewing Company 1899-1900.

Several collectors believe that the first crown used in Baltimore was by the George Bauernschmidt Brewing Co. The earliest can be seen at this link Earliest Crown. You can click on the pictures to expand them. These crowns are hand applied and not swipe tops and are crudely applied.

www.sodasandbeers.com can be used to serach for other examples of early crown bottles. Although the I do not agressively catalogue crown top bottles, I will catalogue cross over bottles where the same mold is used to produce both blob and crown bottles.

Painter was also a big advertiser of his closures. I have lists of bottlers that he advertised using the Loop Seal in the early 1890s that list hundreds of bottles by state. I believe that I have seen similar lists of crown users form the same period. Get one of these list and you will be able to id early uses of crown.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Tod ~

It was good to hear from you. You have certainly done your homework on old bottles, and your website is one of the best of it's kind. In fact, I was perusing it just the other day, and have had it in my favorites file for some time now. But, to tell you the truth, I eventually steered away from it when I discovered it primarily focused on hutch/blob type of closures. But I see now after taking another look at the beer bottle listings, (which I had passed over earlier), that there is a great deal of helpful information to be discovered. I am kind of wondering though why there are few if any dates listed with the image/description pages that focus on a particular bottle? But still a great site, and the first time I ever came across the term "pony bottle," which I had never heard of before. If you happen to have one of the "list" you referred to, or know of a link where one can be found, please share it with us. I wouldn't be surprised if it is just what I have been looking for.

Thank you for your time and interest in what is beginning to look like a "neverending" pursuit of the first/earliest crown-top bottle ever produced. You are to be commended for you contributions to the bottle collecting hobby worldwide.

In closing, I would like to share a little about the photo(s) below which, by the way, I found because of your recommendations.

I'm still researching these two particular bottles, and although the information on them was somewhat non-specific, it did say they were examples of the "transition" period from Hutch/Blob to Crown ... "Circa" 1900. It said both bottles were from Johannesburg (Mass ?) and were retrieved from the same dump in Forest Hill, (Boston area ?) I would give my eye teeth for either one of them. I love emerald green bottles!

Thanks again Tod ... My hat is off to you!

Respectfully,

SODAPOPBOB ... a.k.a., Bob []

Blob on left = Kops & Rawlings
Crown on right = Crystal Springs

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Like I've said previously, this appears to be a "neverending" thread. But this may be the last post from me on the subject unless I happen to stumble across something specific that distinctly states, "This is the earliest crown bottle known to man." But I'm beginning to think this may never occur.

So with that said, I would like to cast the spotlight on Coca Cola for a moment who, as we all know, surely must have been in the thick of things during the transition period from Hutch to Crown. And yet, even with the endless amount of information available on the history of the Coca Cola company, the information regarding their first crown-top bottles is somewhat sketchy at best.

The straight-sided Coca Cola bottle shown here is listed as "circa" 1900-1905, and most likely is one of Coca Cola's very earliest crowns. But to say for a fact it is the "first" one that Coca Cola ever produced is something we may never know for sure. Perhaps a visit by someone to the Coca Cola museum in Atlanta, Georgia will be where the answer(s) will eventually be found.

But please don't hesitate to keep posting those photos. I'm sure our elusive "King of the Crowns" is out there somewhere.

Thanks again to all members who took the time and interest to participate in and/or view this thread.

My hat is off to each and every one of you.

Sincerely,

SODAPOPBOB

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Here is the "Ackerman Soda Water Co." bottle I spoke about at the top of page 4. On that same page, member "celerycola" posted an old Ackerman magazine ad he said was from 1894. I just got my bottle in the mail today and was pleasantly surprised to discover it was in a lot better shape than the seller had indicated. He said it was badly caseworn. But as you can see from the photo there is barely any rubbed areas on it at all. I think I did okay for $15.00.

I'm still trying to more accurately date it. It has a huge embossed "A" on the bottom, and a teany-tiny (slant/connected) AB on the heal. I found this for the small AB, but not sure yet about the huge "A."

"American Bottling Company 1905-1917"

The information I found on this company is a little confusing. Maybe someone can tell me more. My bottle is definitely blown in a mold, and has an applied and tooled lip. Plus it's obviously a "crown-top."

Thanks,

SPB

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Regarding my interest in finding out more about the American Bottling Company, I contacted Bill Lockhart, (who is well know for having done extensive research on various aspects of bottling), and below is the copy/pasted reply to the inquiry I sent him. So it appears that my Ackerman bottle is a fairly early crown, but obviously not the first. However, I am still interested in fnding out more about the "Ackerman Soda Water Co." of St. Louis, Missouri, and if anyone has information or a website link regarding this, I would very much appreciate hearing from you.

Thanks,

SPB

(Bill Lockhart's reply).

Hi Bob,
[/align]That bottle style was popular during the very early 20th century, especially the 1900-1910 period. With the AB-connected manufacturer's mark, it would date between 1905 and 1909. The large "A" on the base is for Ackerman. Crown-capped soda bottles often had either the initial of the company, the company name (if the name were short enough), or the two initials of the owner on the base from about 1900 to the mid-1930s. This was a hangover from the Hutchinson-style bottles that were used prior to the invention of the crown cap. Hutchinsons were packed with the finish/top down to keep the seal wet. In order to easily distinguish that a case of empty bottles ONLY had their own brand, many Hutch users had their initial (or company name) embossed on the base in a large letter. The practice continued with crown caps -- even though the main reason no longer existed.[/align] [/align]The terms soda water, soda pop, pop, and soda all mean exactly the same thing. Soda water is the oldest term. It was eventually shortened to just "soda" and was the term used by the bottling and bottle making industries. Pop was a term used in common speech. It apparently originated in England in the late 19th century with cod-stopper bottles. When the marble that plugged the opening was forced into the bottle, it made a loud popping sound, and the kids began calling it "pop."[/align] [/align]Bill[/align]

 

[Bottle Junkie 56]

ncbred, Punch-I-Nello was also bottled in Rocky Mount, NC. I have the bottle. It is aqua with the little goomer figure embossed on it, but no 5 cent embossing. Much tougher to find than Wilson. Thanks. Randy

 

[RED Matthews]

Hello to both Jay and SPB. This thread is the type of thing I enjoy on the Forum. Thank you both for your reviews. Through my years of working with glass studies, I never had the time to get into all the little details of when, what type of finish was used from when to when, or all the different types of glass items that had their own indiviual ideosyncracies. These coverages help a lot Thanks!!!
RED Matthews