Help on Seltzer Bottles Value and Info. please!?

[kbohannon]

Hello everyone! I'm trying to find out more about these old seltzer bottles. I've been researching on them for quite some time but haven't seen any like these, and the spouts are unique as well. I'm thinking they're maybe Argentinian? And what I've read i think the colors are rarer also. Any input from you guys and gals would be GREATLY appreciated!
PICS BELOW

Seltzer 1
Seltzer 2
Seltzer 3
Seltzer 4
Seltzer 5

 

[epackage]

Argentinian very likely, in very good colors if you're looking to sell them....easy to find past sales of those like them on e-bay....Welcome to the forum....Jim

http://www.ebay.com/csc/i.html?_nkw=seltzer+argentina&_sacat=29797&_sop=3&LH_Complete=1&_odkw=seltzer&_osacat=29797&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313

 

[kbohannon]

Thanks for the help epackage! So i take it the rarer more valuable seltzer bottles are the purple darker colors? Couldn't really find any dark purples or reds online, but i found a few yellows. Also the spouts on mine seem to be more detailed and intricate than the simple ones i've seen online. And yes i do plan on selling these, another question do you guys think i would have trouble getting $100 or more on them? (Going to sell seperately most likely).
Thanks!

 

[epackage]

The tops aren't all that important, people want these for the color. I would think these could bring $100 each for sure...Good Luck...Jim

 

[ChicagoOutfit]

Actually,
With all due respect (I mean, you do have over 15,000 posts, epackage), I would like to give a more valid answer as to Argentine seltzer bottles.

1) Tops are VERY important. Tops are VERY important. Tops are VERY important. The most valuable Argentine seltzer bottles have their matching lead syphons (tops) still intact and attached. Make certain that the molded number on the lead syphon matches the molded number on the glass bottle. Attached is a quick snap of one of the bottles that I have just purchased while in Buenos Aires, Argentina. You'll note that they both have the same (a) production number and (b) brand/label. In this case its "322" and "Rodeiro Gonzalez". Tops are more valuable because because during the tough times of Argentina (of which there have been many), people melted the lead syphons down for their lead content. Thus, having a matched lead syphon (top) and glass bottle are more valuable.

2) The following colors are the only actual vintage colors from roughly the 1910's to the 1960's (and therefore collector desired): dark cobalt blue, light cobalt blue, and dark green. Those are the only colors (really, it's the naturally occurring color of the glass-making process at the time - not "coloring" by any third party). Anything other than those three colors has been manipulated for "artistic" purposes. Reds, yellows, pinks, purples, etc. are not vintage; they are third parties that have taken something that most likely isn't even vintage and painted it on the inside with a paint. These are not original to the era of the 1910's to the 1960's in any way. These are not worth more to any collector of seltzer bottles because they are not actual items from a past era. I am not saying that they are "worthless," after all they are worth whatever they mean to you and/or whatever someone pays you for them... but they are not collectible as period pieces of actual vintage pieces in any way. Again, they are painted. See an example of a sign put up by a serious vendor in the San Telmo neighborhood of Buenos Aires: http://bit.ly/14FYg1g

3) Other miscellaneous items: seltzer bottles with interior glass stems are vintage and more valuable (if the interior stem is plastic, you know it's not from the 1910's to the 1960's), the more ornate the molding of the bottle - the higher the value (later in the period, bottles re-used a circular stamp and simply changed the logo within the circular stamp - cutting down on production costs), bottles with etched logos (which looked shaved, instead of molded) are even less valuable because they do not come from molds - they are all from the same mold with the etching done later.

I realize that this post is old, but I wanted to help with information that would be on-point for anyone that searched these forums in the future. Thanks,
ChicagoOutfit

 

[surfaceone]

2) The following colors are the only actual vintage colors from roughly the 1910's to the 1960's (and therefore collector desired): dark cobalt blue, light cobalt blue, and dark green. Those are the only colors (really, it's the naturally occurring color of the glass-making process at the time - not "coloring" by any third party). Anything other than those three colors has been manipulated for "artistic" purposes. Reds, yellows, pinks, purples, etc. are not vintage; they are third parties that have taken something that most likely isn't even vintage and painted it on the inside with a paint. These are not original to the era of the 1910's to the 1960's in any way. These are not worth more to any collector of seltzer bottles because they are not actual items from a past era.

Hello Seltzer Obsessive ChicagoOutfit,

Argentine seltzers are swell, and I'm sure your perspective on colors related to same is quite right, however, and "actually" there are quite a number of glass colors, other than those that you have mentioned, that have been produced by glass houses, the world over, for thousands of years.

From.

It's most important, in effective ball-busting, to have facts on your side. [8D]

 

[epackage]

ORIGINAL: ChicagoOutfit
The following colors are the only actual vintage colors from roughly the 1910's to the 1960's (and therefore collector desired): dark cobalt blue, light cobalt blue, and dark green. Those are the only colors (really, it's the naturally occurring color of the glass-making process at the time - not "coloring" by any third party). Anything other than those three colors has been manipulated for "artistic" purposes. Reds, yellows, pinks, purples, etc. are not vintage; they are third parties that have taken something that most likely isn't even vintage and painted it on the inside with a paint. These are not original to the era of the 1910's to the 1960's in any way. These are not worth more to any collector of seltzer bottles because they are not actual items from a past era. I am not saying that they are "worthless," after all they are worth whatever they mean to you and/or whatever someone pays you for them... but they are not collectible as period pieces of actual vintage pieces in any way. Again, they are painted. See an example of a sign put up by a serious vendor in the San Telmo neighborhood of Buenos Aires: http://bit.ly/14FYg1g

How do you explain the red seltzer here, from Buenos Aries and dated 1908, or the peach colored example dated 1906? By the way they sold for $600 each....

 

[ChicagoOutfit]

Okay,
I tried to respond with as much respect as I could with my original post, and be as informative as I could about why I stated what I stated. I am not here to get into a G*d-damned pissing match with anyone. I am not calling out anyone as wrong, and I am not saying that what I state is the only correct statement. Let me just clarify:

- I did not state that no other glass colors or treatments existed, aside from the three that I mentioned... as surfaceone says I implied ("there are quite a number of glass colors, other than those that you have mentioned, that have been produced by glass houses, the world over, for thousands of years"). What I said was that those were the three colors that occurred with actual, vintage Argentine seltzer bottles because those were the materials that they used to make the glass in that era. That's different from me saying "no colors aside from these three were in existence in glass before the 1960's." Very different statement. Come on, man.

- How do I explain the differing colors from 1906 or 1908, epackage? It's quite simple, actually... they were painted. What's so difficult about understanding that? If I bought a Ford Model-T and painted it green... would I then be able to say that it was an authentic and original green Model-T? No. It was painted. They only came in black, no matter what you may find on the market.

All that I wanted to do was help educate people a little bit on Argentine seltzer bottles (not New York seltzer bottles, not Miami seltzer bottles, etc.). One, original and matching/numbered/labeled lead tops are VERY important (hmm... nobody seems to be calling me out on that). Two, colors are very important (see the signs that vendors here on the ground in San Telmo, Buenos Aires, Argentina have all over the markets and shops). Three, I never laid out any pricing or gave "worth" for anything... so I'm glad someone got $600 for their bottles. Kudos to them. All that I'm saying is that those "red" and "peach" bottles are not actual pieces from that era (as in my example of a Model-T). I don't feel much like getting cross-examined, but I will attempt to get back to you with anything else you want to "test" me on for whatever reason you feel I'm wronging the antique bottle Gods.

Thanks,
ChicagoOutfit

 

[epackage]

They weren't painted, I owned them and handled them personally, you have no clue what you're talking about...[]

 

[ChicagoOutfit]

ORIGINAL: epackage

They weren't painted, I owned them and handled them personally, you have no clue what you're talking about...[]

Says the man that stated "The tops aren't all that important, people want these for the color." What a joke. Absolutely laughable advice. You have absolutely no standing when you speak about Argentine seltzer bottles. Point blank. Period. Let me ask you this about your wonderful offerings:

- Did the number on the lead syphons match the number on your "peachy peach" bottle?
- Did the brand on the lead syphon match the brand on your "peachy peach" bottle?
- Was the rubber seal a dark orange, and not white?
- Was it a glass stem?
- Was the mold all of the way around the bottle, and not simply a circle with a label in it?
- Was it even molded or was it etched?
- etc.

I could go on and on in trying to teach you a thing or two about Argentine seltzer bottles... but I'd be wasting my time. My true hope is that whomever may read this, actually do research for themselves and not take your replies as gospel.

Hey, maybe I'll go down to the San Telmo market tomorrow to purchase a $45 syphon from 1906 and then screw it on to a painted tie-dyed bottle from 2013. Since you state that "The tops aren't all that important, people want these for the color," I'll just tell people that it's a very rare, hard-to-find (possibly never before seen!) multi-colored, vintage bottle... because, after all, you have no clue about how to determine validity by the most simple of first acid tests: paired numbers/brands. (Psst... they paint clear bottles on the inside, not the outside. So, it's not like I'm talking about having a thick coat of latex paint on the outside. You can check for these thin layers of paint by spinning the bottles against the sun or other light source.)

I am coming at this via a purely historical perspective; by helping people to determine if it is an actual vintage piece... and not to assign value. Like I said, these bottles "are worth whatever they mean to you and/or whatever someone pays you for them."

Now, I'm going out to tango at La Catedral in Buenos Aires (check my IP Address if you like). I think that I know a thing or two about Argentina. Have fun in Jersey, my man.
ChicagoOutfit