Possilbe prototype Mountain Dew bottle or hoax?

[fishnuts]

I phoned the seller a few moments ago.
The seller said this bottle came from a find 17 years ago( did not elaborate on where, etc.). Since it had no city...and he has no experience or interest(collects picture labels only...but would not take my Orchard in trade)) in MD, it just sat. And sat. Six years ago a Texas (unnamed) collector heard of it and offered him, well..a lot (unspecified). He turned the offer down.
It is not an overprint, he said, as best as he can tell. It's in super good condition. Doesn't know the origin.
Hopefully expects a price in the value range morb stated.

Good Luck Dew Hounds.

 

[splante]

could be legit but sounds fishy , too many red flags. The copyright and mountain dew transaction questions would keep me away from it for now.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

I just upped the bid to $200.00 ... but reserve still not reached. Should I / Would you go to $500.00 ???

And here is the generic bid confirmation I just received from e-bay ...

So far, so good! Your bid has been confirmed, and you are the high bidder. It's almost yours, but you could still be outbid. You can improve your chances of winning by increasing your bid.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

I'm Convinced!
[/align] [/align] [/align] [/align]It's a Prototype![/align][/align]

 

[morbious_fod]

Here's the reason I think it it a prototype. First off if there were a gross (100 pcs) ordered even as a re-purposed bottles one of these should have already surfaced with the sheer amount of Mountain Dew hillbilly bottle collectors out there. If there was an actual production run of several grosses then the possibility of one surfacing before now increases greatly. There are very few unknown bottles in Mountain Dew bottles, there are some that we even know should exist; however, haven't seen the light of day yet. Most of these are from the pre-Pepsi period. Basically it's condition appears to have never been put through a bottling line, it sports a later previously unknown design using the later "Pepsi Hillbilly" in a much earlier period, the transition to the new Pepsi hillbilly tends to be around 67 or 68. It's not the fact that the words Mountain Dew are over and under, there is a change in the font from a thinner to a fatter font between the two logos, check out the W and the dot on the eye between the two, they are similar but very different. Pepsi acquired the Tip Corporation (Mountain Dew and all) in 1964, according to the Wall Street Journal article from September 9, 1964, also Marion Bottling Company (a Pepsi bottler) first picked up the brand in 1965.

It just looks too good to be a fake; however, it could still be one. I do think Fish is right that the cost would be prohibitive. Could this be a prototype made for a single bottler, that is possible, but the use of the later Pepsi Hillbilly during the Hartman Hillbilly period is odd. This thing is going to hit the roof, and I don't blame the seller for turning down your trade. If this is real it will reach the Party Jug levels in value.

As for whether or not to take a chance, this is one of one so far and no provenance or other proof of it's authenticity has been seen. Buyer beware.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Morb ~
I apologize for hogging so much air time here, but since I have decided to dip into my savings and take a shot at the bottle, I was hoping you wouldn’t mind my exuberence and grant me a little leeway here. I realize it is still a bit of a crap shoot as to whether the bottle is original and genuine, but based on everything I have been able to ascertain at the present, I am 100% convinced it is the real deal.

Some may ask, if I intend to try and be the highest bidder, why draw any more attention to it than necessary? Wouldn’t it be better to just let it alone and see what happens? My reply to this is that I am intentionally trying to attract attention to it! I want someone to break the reserve so I (and numerous others) will know exactly where we stand. I never did like that reserve business anyway, but suppose there may be advantages to it that I am not aware of. Personally, I think a seller should just establish a minimum starting price and let the chips fall where they may.

I won’t go into detail as to how much I intend to bid, but suffice it to say that I feel we may very well be looking at the next “Holy Grail†of acl soda bottles. My philosophy at the moment is to “shoot first†and then ask questions and do the research on it afterwards. If it turns out to be a fluke of some kind, then so be it. But I am willing to take that gamble on what I presently feel is a 80% possibility of it being a genuine prototype that for one reason or another just never made it’s way into full production.

And for those who have been following this thread with the same measure of interest that I have, I’d like to share the following article I came across recently regarding part of the transition period when the Mountain Dew brand was becoming a PepsiCo product. I am not entirely sure what year(s) the article is referring to, but I believe it was either in the late 1950s or very early 1960s. And the part I would like to focus on is near the end where it talks about Bill Jones “testing†different formulas. I know it is talking about testing the flavor formula itself and not a new bottle design, but it may be a clue that suggest the possibility that other forms of experimentation (including a new bottle design) were being conducted during this same time period. Thus, as Morb brought to light during the very onset of this thread, that the bottle could very well have been a prototype. And that’s good enough for me!

Morb : Thanks again for allowing me to participate in this most interesting topic, and especially for bringing it to our attention in the first place. Now that’s what I call sharing.

Your “Buyer Beware†recommendation is duly noted! Thanks.

SODAPOPBOB

{Article} / {Slightly edited for clarity}

When Bill Jones took over the Tip Corporation, and in order to finance his new enterprise, he needed investors, so he offered shares in the new company to some of his bottler friends. The original investors were Pepsi-Cola bottlers: Herman Minges of Lumberton, North Carolina; Richard Minges of Fayetteville, North Carolina; Allie Hartman of Knoxville, Tennessee; and Wythe Hull of Marion, Virginia.

Using Wythe Hull's Pepsi-Cola bottling facility in Marion, Virginia as a base of operations, Jones began testing different formulas. Employees at the Marion Pepsi plant were the first to sample each new version of the drink. Finally, one mixture seemed to have the right taste.

IS IT POSSIBLE THE BOTTLE CAME FROM OR WAS CONNECTED IN SOME WAY TO THE MARION, VIRGINIA BOTTLING PLANT ?






　
　
　

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

I just upped the bid to $300.00 and the reserve is still not met! Dang it! []

 

[morbious_fod]

Like you need permission to post. I started the tread to discuss this possible new exciting find in the brand's history.

Bill Jones did modify the formula in the early 1960's; however, not the bottle. I had always kinda wondered why Pepsi kept the straight side Mountain Dew bottle design when they produced nearly every other offering in either a swirl (Pepsi, Diet Pepsi, etc) or the diamond pattern design (Patio, Teem, etc), this bottle shows that it is very possible that they did indeed try to modify the Mountain Dew bottles to fit in with the rest of the line, but ultimately decided against it. This bottle is a very interesting find that expands the story of the brand. It would be nice to have one, but I don't think I am willing to take that much of a chance, just in case this is a hoax.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

While we are waiting to see what develops (3 days 19 hours left) I could use a little help on something. I am trying to determine what year the "Teem" bottles (if they ever did) started showing up with the dots on the lower part of the neck as seen on the Mountain Dew prototype in question? The two bottles below are {left} 1962 and {right} 1969. The only example of a "low dot" bottle I have been able to find was on the gono.com site, and that was a barely discernable black and white photo.

If anyone has an example(s) of a Teem "low dot" bottle, please check the date(s) and let us know what you come up with. This may not tell us anything specific, other than the possibility of giving us some idea of just how many of these so called "low dot" bottles that went into production. If it turns out there are zero or very few, it may be a clue of some kind to aid in future research.

Thanks a lot,

SPBOB

Teem 1962 (no dots) & 1969 (high dots)

Reminder ... We are looking for "low dot" examples. Thanks.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

In answer to my own question, I just found this example of a Teem bottle that is currently on e-bay and has the "low dot" acl application I was referring to. I lucked out in that the seller's discription said it was embossed on the bottom LCW63 2 (No doubt they misread the G and thought it was a C). Which most of us know translates ... Laurens Glass Works 1963. And which we also know is what the Mt. Dew/Teem bottle has on the base ... LG65 (1965).

I am not exactly sure where I am going with us, or what it might and might not reveal, but at least we now know that the Laurens Glass Works is a legitimate maker of PepsiCo bottles, and that the "low dot" acls were certainly available at least as early as 1963.

My next task will be to try and determine if there are 1965 "low dot" bottles. And hopefully with the help from members here we may be able to determine just when the dots migrated to the upper part of the neck. Of course, if there are multiple-multiple variations, then my search here may be in vain.

The main thing I'm attempting to determine here is if the dots were on the Mountain Dew/Teem bottle intentionally or just happened to be there when the Mt. Dew label was applied? We know the bottle is obviously a Pepsi/Teem bottle, but it just strikes me odd that PepsiCo (even if this was a prototype experiment) would use the dots on an already established design. "Or" (if it is a fake) that the alleged counterfeiter just forgot to remove the dots when he "scraped off" the Teem acl?

So back to my request ... I am currently looking for a 1965 Teem bottle with "low dots."

(If this is driving you nuts, just think of the scrambled eggs that are cooking inside of my head) []

Thanks again

SPBOB

TEEM LGW63