Vernors Ginger Ale 150th B-Day

[VernorsGuy]

Well, as long as you said cards.....

This has a copyright date of 1888.

 

[hemihampton]

P.S.

To summarize in a single sentence ...

Because of the likelihood that James Vernor bought the Arctic Soda Fountain from William Johnston, it makes me wonder why he would do that unless he intended to use it himself?

View attachment 174624

Maybe he used it to sell/serve his Customers Vernor's Ginger Ale. makes sense to me. LEON.

 

[SODABOB]

Maybe he used it to sell/serve his Customers Vernor's Ginger Ale. makes sense to me. LEON.

Leon

You hit the nail on the head with the word ...

"Maybe"

Which sort of takes us back to square one. Meaning; I wish we could eliminate such words as maybe, possibly, might have, perhaps, etc; and be able to determine with absolute certainty ...

1. If James Vernor did or did not have a soda fountain at his Woodward Avenue drug store prior to about 1880?

2. If James Vernor did or did not produce and sell his Ginger Ale prior to about 1880?

And if the answer to either or both of the above questions is "Yes, he did!" then why is it even a question and where is the evidence, proof, confirmation, to substantiate it? It seems to me it shouldn't be that difficult to find. And yet, here we are still wondering about it. (At least I still am)

 

[hemihampton]

Sounds like we have proof he had a soda fountain he used for 10 days in 1868. Now we need proof he sold Vernor's using it for that 10 days. I don't think the ad would go so far as to specify he used Vernors in it but if it did then it would be case closed wouldn't? LEON.

 

[SODABOB]

I'm not sure what I stumbled on to here and whether its relevant or not, but I thought it was kind of interesting. Earlier I posted some ads for W. Johnston's Drug Store regarding his involvement with the sale of Arctic Soda Fountains. I was curious about him and discovered he had a drug store(s) in Detroit at least as early as 1862. That would have been the same time period when Higby & Stearns was going strong. I also discovered that W. Johnston had a soda fountain where he served Belfast Ginger Ale. (And possibly his own brand of ginger ale, but I'm still looking for confirmation on that). Anyway, he was a prolific advertiser and it appears he was quite successful. This got me to wondering about other drug stores who had soda fountains and served ginger ale, especially those who did a lot of advertising. The reason I'm tying this in with a Vernor's discussion, is because there seems to have been a great deal of competition among Detroit drug stores in the late 1860s and early 1870s, and W. Johnston seems to have been one of the biggest.

Which makes me wonder ...

What, if any, influence Johnston and Vernor might have had on one another? Surely they were aware of each other, being as they were both druggist in the same city and, as near as I can determine, almost in the same neighborhood. Johnston was at Jefferson Avenue and Vernor was at Woodward Avenue. I realize customers probably didn't travel long distances during that time just to buy a glass of ginger ale, but I doubt druggist relied strictly on customers within a few blocks of their store for all of their sales. If that was the case, then why advertise if all you needed to do to stay solvent was to rely on local trade? With my point being; if someone like W. Johnston was big into advertising his soda fountain and ginger ale, then why wouldn't someone like James Vernor do the same? Vernor advertised flowers, cigars, etc; but if he had a soda fountain and served ginger ale there, then why not advertise those as well?

Anyway, here's what I thought was an interesting newspaper page from ...

The Detroit Free Press ~ May 25, 1873

(There are approximately 20 Johnston's ads on this one page)

(There are no Vernor's ads on this page)

(Save and zoom to read in detail)





Sampling of Johnston's ads







Reminder:

Because W. Johnston was an authorized agent for Tufts' Fountain Apparatus', I'm thinking its "possible" that James Vernor bought his Arctic Fountain from him. If so, then they likely knew each other and possibly talked about such things as soda fountains and ginger ale.

 

[SODABOB]

P.S.

The newspaper I just posted falls in with what I said earlier about soda fountain and ginger ale ads being easy to find. There are literally tons of them between about 1860 and 1880 - but the earliest Vernor's Ginger Ale reference I can find still stand at 1884.

 

[SODABOB]

I'm going to share this ad and call it a day. Starting tomorrow, I'm going to see what else I can find about my mysterious Mr. Johnston. Maybe he was ... ???

From ...

The Detroit Free Press ~ April 30, ​1871

I think the smudged word is 'Dealer'

 

[SODABOB]

One more for the road - from Page 3 Post #21 of this thread - June 20, 2016

"Drug Store Counter" ???

Speaking of Vernor's newspaper accounts, here's just one of hundreds ...

The Detroit Free Press ~ June 17, 1941

View attachment 172759

Key wording ...

1. 1866

2. Offered over his drug store counter, Vernor's Ginger Ale was received with immediate enthusiasm.

View attachment 172760

 

[VernorsGuy]

Bob or others with your amazing resources-

Do you have any dates or information on C.R. Holman? This Vernor's seltzer/syphon says "Vernor's Ginger Ale sold by C.R. Holman".

Not even sure if this is Detroit or somewhere else.

Syphons in this style began in 1830 - but never changed much. Maybe Holman's era will help us date Vernor's.

 

[hemihampton]

Really like that Seltzer, I got a few from Detroit & Michigan & never seen that one. LEON.