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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by OsiaBoyce View Post
    So what ya think about em'? What do you think they represent? Think they should be removed from sight? Hate the Confederate flag? How does affect you and why? Seems there have not been many worthwhile subjects here recently, so here's one. Anyone have forefathers that served in the Confederate Army? Yankee army?
    Hi OsiaBoyce: As I mentioned in this thread to another poster,
    I think we are talking about two different situations that emerge nowadays. On one hand we have your mundane white supremacists, KKK-types, largely uneducated and misinformed, who rally around monuments and use them to somehow glorify slavery, racism, and hate from the past, and to justify them today. They attempt to use a great person or event to make them feel better and bolster their social and moral values in the eyes of the public. They use monuments and symbols entirely and fraudulently wrong.

    On the other hand, we have people who genuinely admire the courage and brilliance of Confederate leaders and their soldiers (and of Union leaders/soldiers for that matter), regardless of their views of racism and slavery. They do not use monuments and other symbols to justify and legitimize their social/political and moral values, much less to popularize them

    I fall in the latter camp. The problem is usually there is very little or no educational value attached to these monuments and symbols. Included on their plaques should be what the noted person or place meant to Africans who were torn from their homes, thousands of miles away, and forced into deadly slavery; what slavery meant to our nation, socially, culturally and politically - then and now. I feel monuments are OK, so long as they include this type of educational component.

    Otherwise as we know, uneducated, misinformed citizens are the greatest threat to democracy, and to our Founding Father ideals of "...all men are created equal..." and due process/asylum eligibility, and to the values symbolized by our Statue of Liberty.

  2. #22
    Senior Member Bottle Master
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    "I have no problem.............so long as a plaque is added." From this statement it would seem you do have issues with these monuments, what are they? Why add a plaque, do they not say enough already? These monuments were erected in memory of the lost lives of the men and boys who served in a cause they believed in................................................ .....nothing else.

  3. #23
    Junior Member New Bottler
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    Hey, Those so strongly opposed to an image, believing those images must be removed should pause to consider the next individual offended by an image of their religion. To think that a symbol perpetuates and proliferates an ideology, I believe is a grave error. Indoctrination to any way of thinking requires much more than imagery.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Bottle Master coldwater diver's Avatar
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    Interesting thread and also very sad that this is happening. We live in a land of hysteria now. The kids are being brainwashed to despise and hate this country, to not teach American history but to reinterpret it in this lens that the earths death is imminent, the country was founded and stolen by evil white men on the backs of the black and red man. 1984 took a little longer to get hear but these crazies want to censor what you say, think, and do. They get to decide who is offended and whats offensive irregardless of any other opinion on the subject.
    I took a trip to Fredricksburg Va as a 15 or 16 year old and went to the civil war parks. The town changed hands many times during the Civil War. I was standing near a rock wall and they had photos of the exact same spot i was in. I looked carefully at this photo many soldiers lying dead behind it. I guess Id never seen a photo with dead people but I could not help but look at every face. I'm now 52 and I still remember that photo and still feel sorrow for those killed in it.These boys and men fought through the lens of their time and it was horrible. Very hard to be the judge and jury over the south today nor should we.
    The amazing thing is this county persevered and united again. As far as statues of George Washing ton in the UK ? Thats across the pond in another country,
    the ones we are talking about are in the South. Erected by people in the South. they were proud of those who fought and died for the South. I would venture a guess though, that there are no statues of General Sherman in Atlanta or General Grant in Vicksburg.
    Now they are talking reparations to I guess those who may be decedents of slaves from over 150years ago. Another topic I know but its akin to the same hysteria Irregardless of the 620,000 killed in the war that ended slavery.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Bottle Master
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    Well said Kevin...



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