EARLIEST OWENS-ILLINOIS SODA BOTTLE MARK (NON-ACL)

[morbious_fod]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

Another example of the earlier duller acl.

Note how the white is almost a light grey instead of bright white.With the Yellow on this bottle you can really see what I mean by thinner.

 

[morbious_fod]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

Now compare it to this 1939, from the same bottling company and glassworks, but a couple of years later.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

Morb ~

Thanks again.

I actually knew what you meant when you said "duller," and not sure why I said "extremely faded." But in any event I agree with your observationa that the first acls were no doubt experimental until they finally perfected the process. The insert below is from my acl book and refers to "the early days" when pine oil mediums were used, which in part may explain the duller labels. I suspect even those pine oils went through various stages until they finally came up with the thermoplactics that the article says were first introduced in the "mid 1950s."

I went back and read through some of the post in the "Earliest ACLs" thread, and realize now that during the course of that thread most (if not all) of us unanimously agreed that any Owens-Illinois single-digit date code with a dot automatically meant it was a 1940s bottle. But now I'm wondering, because of the exceptions to this rule that have surfaced along the way, if some of those "dotted" bottles may in fact be from the 1930s? I can't help but ask myself; where can it be found with 100% positive proof that an Owens-Illinois acl soda bottle marked with 9 <(I)> 3. is a 1943 acl and not a 1933 acl? Especially if it doesn't have Duraglas or stippling on the base? Thus my reason for us to take another look at some of those single-digit 1s 2s 3s and 4s.

SPB

Following this paragraph is another one that states; Pine oils were "liquid" based, whereas thermoplactics were "solid" based. I'm not sure what the specific difference was, but it may explain the "duller" finishes vs the "brighter" finishes.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

P.S. ~

I realize I am going out on a limb here regarding the possibility of there being 1931 thru 1934 acls, and that I am putting all of my eggs in one basket simply because of a single sentence where Jack Paquette states ...

"Another development the Company announced that year [1931] was a glass decorating innovation called "Applied Color Lettering," or "ACL."

... but I just find it extremely hard to accept that it took the world's largest manufacturer of soda bottles four or five years before they began producing acl sodas. The author could just as easily have worded it differently by saying something like "in the early thirties." But he didn't, he specifically said 1931. According to the book, Jack Paquette worked for the Owens-Illinois Company for 33 years, starting in July of 1951 through July of 1984. So I just gotta believe he knows what he's talking about. He was there when they introduced "thermoplastics" to the acl process.

SPB

 

[morbious_fod]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

ORIGINAL: SODAPOPBOB

P.S. ~

I realize I am going out on a limb here regarding the possibility of there being 1931 thru 1934 acls, and that I am putting all of my eggs in one basket simply because of a single sentence where Jack Paquette states ...

"Another development the Company announced that year [1931] was a glass decorating innovation called "Applied Color Lettering," or "ACL."

... but I just find it extremely hard to accept that it took the world's largest manufacturer of soda bottles four or five years before they began producing acl sodas. The author could just as easily have worded it differently by saying something like "in the early thirties." But he didn't, he specifically said 1931. According to the book, Jack Paquette worked for the Owens-Illinois Company for 33 years, starting in July of 1951 through July of 1984. So I just gotta believe he knows what he's talking about. He was there when they introduced "thermoplastics" to the acl process.

SPB

There was the tidbit I was waiting for, he started working for the company in 1951, twenty years after the events he's reporting on, another good question is when was this book published? My point is that they might have started developing the idea in 1931, but it took a few years to perfect it and sell it to the bottlers, that's why it would take until 1934 to produce the first commercially sold acls, in sodas anyway. If he had actually been working for the company in 1931 then I would be more apt to buy it, but he is obviously going from memory of what he has been told, or at best possibly company records.

1934 Jumbo A Super Cola produced by Owens Illinois. BTW is has a number 3 below the logo with a dot beside it. Yet the 4 to the right of the logo has no dot.

 

[morbious_fod]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

From the introduction article for Jumbo A Super Cola from the Quality Kist Bottling Company of Johnson City, Tennessee dated September 20, 1934 where Sam Tarver makes a special note about the new package recently perfected by a leading glass manufacturer, and claiming the first Carbonated Beverage bottle to use this process is Jumbo A Super Cola.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

Morb ~

1. The hardcover edition of the book has a copyright date of 2010. My softcover edition is dated 2011. However, this particular book is a "revised" follow-up to his first book which was published in 1984 right after he retired. The 1984 book is titled, "A History of Owens-Illinois, Inc., 1818-1984." He also did another version of the book in 1994. My 2011 edition primarily brings things up to date as of 2009. Jack Parquette was born in 1925 in Toledo, Ohio (Hometown of original Owens-Illinois Co.) As far as I know he is stiil alive and would be about 86 years old now.

2. I agree more research is needed to either confirm or refute the possibility of there being any 1931 thru 1933 acls. But based on the foregoing information I think it is worth looking into.

3. Your "Jumbo" bottle just set the bar as the earliest acl soda bottle I am currently aware of. If nothing else, the article confirms it. Good job! In my opinion you just changed acl soda bottle history as we know it. How'z about a picture of the base for the official record?

Thanks a million, and congratulations on your discovery.

Bob

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

P.S. ~ Morb

Which Owens-Illinois plant number does your "Jumbo" bottle have? If it is any of the plant numbers from my chart that closed before 1944, then it will triple-confirm the 1934 date. (Providing the chart is accurate ~ which I personally believe it is).

Thanks.

Bob

 

[celerycola]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

1934 Jumbo A Super Cola produced by Owens Illinois. BTW is has a number 3 below the logo with a dot beside it. Yet the 4 to the right of the logo has no dot.

I used to have one of those. ;-)

 

[morbious_fod]

RE: Here's your Missing Link from 1930

ORIGINAL: SODAPOPBOB

P.S. ~ Morb

Which Owens-Illinois plant number does your "Jumbo" bottle have? If it is any of the plant numbers from my chart that closed before 1944, then it will triple-confirm the 1934 date. (Providing the chart is accurate ~ which I personally believe it is).

Thanks.

Bob

Unfortunately due to some glass distortions around the bottom that number has been mostly obscured; however, it appears to be a 3, but honestly is could also be a 9 or an 8, but I'm pretty sure it's a 3. Yeah my money is on 3 which is Fairmont, WV.

I'm not shocked that the Jumbo is the earliest so far, it has long been concidered the first. The Double Cola Company website claims the brand was introduced in 1933, so there may be an even earlier one out there from that year.