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Cross & Co. Vancouver B.C. 1894-1963

SODABOB

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2016
1,587
48
Thanks Cc

You are right-on-the-money about dug bottles. If any have or can be found like the one in question, the odds are it originated in your area as opposed to showing up in an antique shop or similar outlet that you never know where it came from. You already know this, but if any dug bottles do come to your attention, be sure and check the bases to see if they were made by a domestic glass maker or by a foreign glass maker such as J L & Co. Determining the glass maker should help to date them as well.

These attachments are the earliest references about franchises I have been able to find for both the United States and Vancouver, Canada. The Vancouver article is dated 1959, with a franchise reference of 1954.

United States ~ Pepsi Cola ~ 1953

Schweppes Franchise  Pepsi_Hartford_Courant_Conn_Fri__Dec_5__1952.jpg


Vancouver, Canada ~ Pepsi Cola ~ 1954

Schweppes Franchise Canada 1954_The_Province_Vancouver Canada_Wed__Jun_10__1959 (1).jpg

Schweppes Franchise Canada 1954_The_Province_Vancouver Canada_Wed__Jun_10__1959 (2).jpg
 

Canadacan

Well-Known Member
Sep 21, 2014
1,531
48
British Columbia
Bob thanks for posting the newspaper clips, and supersized for these now older eyes!...lol!
Yes I'll keep in mind the dating and manufacturer on the base of any future bottles I may run across :)
 

SODABOB

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2016
1,587
48
Update ...

My Schweppes bottle left the San Francisco USPS distribution center this morning at 5:AM and should arrive here sometime next week.

Have a "5-R" GRRRRREAT weekend

Bob
 

SODABOB

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2016
1,587
48
I received the Schweppes bottle the other day and have been researching it ever since. I have also been exchanging emails with the seller who is doing some research as well. The seller's name is Wendi and she lives in Leven, Scotland where the bottle was shipped from. She said her boyfriend found (dug) the bottle in an old dump on the outskirts of Leven. Other than that, she doesn't know its history or where it might have been bottled. We are trying to determine if there was bottler located in Leven at some point, but we haven't found anything specific yet. It might have originated in Glasgow, Scotland which is about 65 miles east of Leven. Glasgow is a much larger city than Leven and likely had several bottlers at one time. I still need to look into that a little closer. I'm still leaning toward it as being made prior to 1937, but nothing definite on that. Although the bottle was definitely made by the John Lumb Glass Company ( J L & Co LDC ). There is a small star embossed on both sides of the neck, but I do not know anything about them yet. I'm hoping the stars will lead to some additional clues about the bottle. Hopefully the attached pictures and images with help tell some of the story that is still unfolding.

Schweppes Bottle Mine.jpg

Schweppes Bottle Mine Star Neck.jpg

Schweppes Base J L & Co LDC 234L16 (1).jpg

Schweppes Base J L & Co LDC 234L16 (2).jpg

Leven, Scotland 1947

Leven Scotland 1947.jpg

Leven Scotland United Kingdom.jpg

Leven and Glasgow appx 65 Miles.png
 

slugplate

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2016
429
63
Interesting that your first three sodas has, what appears to be, an early MASON logo. Was Cross and Co. anyway connected to them? IDK, but I'd check there too.
 

Canadacan

Well-Known Member
Sep 21, 2014
1,531
48
British Columbia
Hey Bob very nice!...interesting that your bottle is from Scottland....remember
Gavin Dalziel Cross was born in Scotland in 1862 and immigrated to Canada in 1892.
Just a coincidence though :)
 

Canadacan

Well-Known Member
Sep 21, 2014
1,531
48
British Columbia
Been a long time since I've had anything to ad to the variation line up on the embossed straight sided crown tops!
I was happy to pick up this Cross & Co variation that I was unaware of! It's embossed on the back 'A. ALEXANDER & Co Ltd LONDON' It has a mint tone with the seam going right through the top, unlike my aqua tinted version with the black highlighted lettering that has an applied lip.
It had quite a bit of rust on it but cleaned up real nice with no haze, I also love the fact it has very strong embossing :)

So
2020-cross (2).jpeg
20200306-cross (1).jpg
20200306-cross (2).jpg
20200306-cross (3).jpg
 

CanadianBottles

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2014
2,665
83
Oh that's interesting! I think it's the first time I've ever seen a Canadian crown top embossed with the name of a British manufacturer on the heel. That's something I usually associate with internal thread stopper bottles. I wouldn't have expected BC companies to be buying ABM crown bottles from the UK, I would have thought by that time it would make much more financial sense to buy from a domestic manufacturer.
 

Canadacan

Well-Known Member
Sep 21, 2014
1,531
48
British Columbia
@CanadianBottles Yes that did seem odd to have a crown top with a UK firm, the other one is not marked by a maker but does have a # 109 on the base. I did check my internal thread to see if it happened to be the same firm but it's marked 'E.B & Co. Ltd.'
There is also a crown top version with ' MADE IN USA '.
20200307_002721.jpg
 

Canadacan

Well-Known Member
Sep 21, 2014
1,531
48
British Columbia
@CanadianBottles So I was digging around through my digital archive and low and behold came across an article about Cross & Co. that makes reference to buying 'B.C.' when possible, they go on to mention they have not yet secured a supplier for Bottles or Crowns in Canada!
And this was in late 1929.
So this does not explain why the bottles were either UK or USA made, and Thorpe's bottles were pretty much the same. I'm not sure why Red Cliff Dominion glass plant could not supply at the time?...or if this firm had just not secured a contract?
Maybe Dominion glass was at full capacity and could not fulfill any further orders.
Also I do have a Cross that's dated 1929 from Illinois Pacific Glass Corp, the next bottle in line is a Dominion with just the diamond D , so obviously shortly after they got Dominion making their bottles.

Cross and Co-The Vancouver Sun, 30 Nov 1929, Sat, Page 41
Cross and Co5-The Vancouver Sun, 30 Nov 1929, Sat, Page 41  - Copy.jpg
 

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