L@@KING FOR G.C. GLASS CODE INFO

[SODAPOPBOB]

The following isn't exactly the "company files" that OsiaBoyce referred to, but its something along those lines. The first link (and copy/pasted info) is from an article written by Bill Lockhart about a specific "Lime Cola" bottler in El Paso, Texas. The bottler discussed is the "El Paso Real Juice Company." According to Bill's research, the "Real Juice Co." of El Paso was in operation between 1935 and 1942. The particular Lime Cola bottle that Bill mentions (and shows a picture of) is marked on the base with ... GC 5412 2 So if Bill's findings are correct, which I believe they are, then this indicates that the GC number 5412 was used between 1935 and 1942. I realize this is not conclusive of anything directly related to a date code, but it may serve as a "clue" for future research.

The link at the bottom is to an Antique-Bottles.net thread where member celerycola states that his Lime Cola bottle (which has the same label as the Bill Lockhart bottle) is "from the 1940s." Again, not conclusive, but another clue indicating that that particular Lime Cola label was being used in the 1940s.

CLUE: We have a GC number 5412 from 1935 to 1942.

[align=left] http://www.sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/EPChap12c.pdf[/align][align=left] [/align][align=left]Front Description: Lime Cola[/align][align=left]Shoulder: Yellow ACL - It’s Definitely Good (upwardly-slanted script)[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Body: [/font]ACL - a red and yellow bulls-eye target is superimposed on a red-outlined, yellow[/align][align=left]Rectangle. A stenciled line below the target outlines the target and top line. Below it is LIME[/align][align=left]COLA (red with a larger L and C - the bottom line of the “L†underlines the other letters and[/align][align=left]Contains TRADE MARK REG in stencil). Below this, a stenciled bar contains MIN. CONT. 12[/align][align=left]FL. OZS. In red.[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Heel: [/font]Bare[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Back Description[/align][align=left]Shoulder: [/font]Bare[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Body: [/font]A yellow burst is stenciled with COOLING / REFRESHING / SATISFYING with[/align][align=left]BOTTLED BY / EL PASO REAL JUICE CO. / EL PASO, TEXAS below it in yellow.[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Heel: [/font]Bare[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Base: [/font]Embossed - GC-connected / 5412/2[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Manufacturer: [/font]Glass Container Corp. (1934-1967)[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold][align=left]Dating: [/font][1935-1942] Although the possibility of earlier container styles exists, this bottle must[/align][align=left]Be dated to the entire life of the company.[/align][font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold]
Collection(s): [/font]Anthony and Maria Romero collection.

~ * ~

Forum Link

Picture of 1940s Lime Cola bottle courtesy of member celerycola

https://www.antique-bottles.net/forum/m-403164/mpage-1/key-lime%252Ccola/tm.htm#403282

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

P.S. ~

To see the Bill Lockhart Lime Cola article you will need to scroll to about mid-page on the link.

[font=timesnewromanpsmt,bold]Dating: [/font][1935-1942] Although the possibility of earlier container styles exists, this bottle must
be dated to the entire life of the company.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Combination Clues ...

1. 1935-1942 Lime Cola bottle with ... GC 5412
2. 1959 Pepsi Cola bottle with ........... GC 5431

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Regarding the "Style" of the bottles currently under examination ...

1. Lime Cola 5412
2. Circle A 5482
3. Pepsi 5431

I can see nothing about their "Style" that they have in common. Each one is totally different from the other. The only thing they seem to have in common is that all of the numbers start with a 54

As for my earlier bottles, whose "Style" is not the same either, both start with the numbers 33

1. 30 Below 3383
2. Gazosa 3357

I'm not sure if this can be considered progress, but al least its "something."

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

I'm still looking for that 1946 GC 5433 Pepsi bottle, but in the meantime here's my 1959 ...

14 A 59
7 GC 1
5431

The interesting (but odd) thing about the two Pepsi bottles is ...

1. They both start with 54
2. But they are 13 years apart.
3. My 1946 has a red-white-blue label - 12 oz
4. My 1959 has a red and white label - 8 oz

I'm sure there is a connection here somewhere, but not sure yet what it is.

1946 = 5433
1959 = 5431

[ Full Image ]

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

[ Base ]

( 1959-60 were the years Pepsi transitioned to their new bottle design )

14 A 59
7 GC 1
5431

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

I guess its time for me to do a little guesswork and speculating ...

If you go back and re-read my hodgepodge of information, you will discover the following ...

The Glass Containers Corp/Inc initially had three plant locations as follows ...

1. 1934 - Vernon, California
2. 1947 - Antioch, California
3. 1953 - Haward, California

GC purchased and acquired ten additional plants when they bought Knox Glass in 1968. But since the 1968 date is outside the relm of the bottles currently being examined, with no known examples to consider, I am putting anything after 1968 on the back burner for the time being.

So far, I have seen and presented only three first-digit numbers. Which are ...

1. 33
2. 53
3. 54

And seven second-digit numbers. Which are ...

1. 12
2. 31
3. 33
4. 57
5. 82
6. 83
7. 84

Resulting in the following combos ...

3357 3383 5384 5412 5431 5433 5482

I'm "guessing" at this juncture that because there were only three plants initially, and only three first-digit numbers prior to 1968, that the first two-digit numbers "might be" Plant location codes as follows ...

1. 1934 Vernon, California = Plant number 33
2. 1947 Antioch, California = Plant number 53
3. 1953 Hayward, California = Plant number 54

Please be reminded this is just a "guess/theory" and that further research is required.

And if this stuff is driving you nuts, just imagine what's going on in my head!

[]

Gracias'

SPB

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Resulting in ...

A formula that does not work accurately with every bottle concerned!

1. 1934 Vernon, California = Plant number 33 = 30 Below/3383 Gazosa/3357
2. 1947 Antioch, California = Plant number 53 =
3. 1953 Hayward, California = Plant number 54 = 1946 Pepsi/5433 1959 Pepsi/5431

I really need to find my so called 1946 Pepsi. It's blowing a huge hole in my theory. But if it turns out to be a 1956 Pepsi, then I'm back on track again. Remember, I said I couldn't remember where I got the picture. Here it is again. Is that a 46 or not? The picture below is all I have to go on. I can't find the bottle and not sure if its even mine.

Aditionally, I am not 100% certain about Bill Lockhart's 1940s Lime Cola/5412. Although I trust his research, without actually seeing the bottle its impossible to say. If it turns out that Bill made a typo error and the Lime Cola is actually 5312 instead of 5412, then it would fit with the Antioch dates.

And please note this is not a case of trying to force a square peg into a round hole. Its about hands-on research I am trying to do with bottles in my own collection. Even celerycola's Lime Cola is unknown to be, and could be from anytime during the 1940s.

Talk about crazy and going nuts ... just bare with me for a couple of more years and I might just figure this thing out. Remember the BRG researcher I mentioned and how she couldn't figure it out either? Now I know what she was talking about. The only difference between her and me is that with me you are seeing the action performed "LIVE" before your very eyes. Now I'm going out to the shed again and either find that 1946 Pepsi bottle or else shoot myself. If you don't hear from me in about a week, then you can assume I chose the latter.

But can you really fault me for trying? Who knows, someday I might be known as the guy who finally broke the GC codes. And then all of you guys will be able to say, "Hey, I knew that guy." []

SPB

To tell you the truth, I'm not 100% sure this is even a Pepsi bottle. I'm just basing that on how it was titled in my photo gallery. But its a GC bottle, that much I'm certain of.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

Well, I didn't shoot myself (yet). But I did look high and low for that mystery/missing so called 1946 Pepsi Cola bottle and I cannot find it anywhere. So until further notice I am scrating it off my list. But whatever brand of soda the base picture is of, its definitely a GC bottle. But whether its a 46 for 1946 or some other date, I just can't say for sure. But I won't deny it "looks" like a 46 in the picture I posted in my last reply.

I'm working on an expanded theory now, but intend to wait until I have all of my ducks in a row before presenting it. But I will say this much; I'm about 99% convinced that the "30 Below" and "Gazosa" acls were made no later than about 1938.

Later.

SPB

Here's the base on my "30 Below" again. The one listed in my acl book indicates a date of 1936.

 

[SODAPOPBOB]

In case you haven't already noticed, I have decided to turn this into a multi-page article. Someday it might serve other collectors conducting similar research. Plus, I like writing (rambling) which gives me something to do in my spare time. I just hope the end result is a worthwhile one.

So with that said, let's continue with ...

Q: Which came first ~ The chicken or the egg?

On second thought, skip that question and let's try this one instead ...

Q: Which came first ~ The bottle mold or the bottle itself?

A: Neither, really.

It was common among most bottle designers to start with a sketch/drawing first. And from there they would create a "wooden" bottle. And from the wooden example they would progress to the metal mold itself which was more often than not "machined" and in some instances even hand chisled as was the case with the prototype Coca Cola bottle that Earl R. Dean created at the Root Glass Factory in Terre, Haute, Indiana in 1915. By the way, no one knows what became of that prototype mold, and if it wasn't destroyed and should turn up someday, it will be worth a jillion dollars.

For starters, here is a link to an eBay listing which shows a variety of different wood bottles that were intended to be used for bottle mold designs.

Link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150756403445&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:en

At the bottom of this page (and one more on the next page) is an example of either a wooden soda or beer bottle. Personally I think its a 64 oz beer bottle, but I'm really not sure.

Note: I don't intend to turn this into a mold thread ~ You will see where I'm going with this in future post.

Thanks.

SPB