17th or 18th Century?

[annie44]

I looked in my new Van den Bossche book (which I love!) at the ones pictured there. It was a quick look as I was on my lunch hour. Most of the enameled flasks are clear, although there is one shown in a darker honey amber.

I'm wondering if anyone knows of a website that shows pictures of reproductions of these flasks, for comparison purposes.

 

[pyshodoodle]

I wish I did - I was trying to find something to compare it to also.

 

[annie44]

Does anyone have the original article from Maine Digest - pictures aren't coming up on the attached link. Not directly related to this thread, but looks like an interesting discussion of "real vs repro"...

http://www.maineantiquedigest.com/articles_archive/articles/mar07/keene0307.htm

 

[CanYaDigIt]

I did a little research on the web and found that both Stiegel and Witmer were extremely religious. Stiegel even had a church built on the second floor of his home and also in his glass house. That could explain the extra detail put into this piece.

The color is poorly represented by the pictures. It is more of a light greenish yellow citron. here is a small bit of a long artical reguarding the items made and the colors typically used.

But his fame was destined to rest on something more stable than eccentricity. The Manheim works turned out a fine grade of window glass, sheet glass, bottles of all sorts, funnels, water lenses (for use as lamp reflectors), barometer tubes, retorts and general druggists’ and chemists’ specialties, flasks, measures, drinking glasses, tumblers, flips, rummers, salt cellars, pepper cruets, sugar bowls, cream ers, pitchers, dishes, bowls, vases, scent bottles, and toys. It turned out “cotton stem†wine glasses which rivaled the famous Bristol examples. It made all these things in flint (so-called “white†or colorless) glass; and some of them in light green, deep emerald, olive, wine, amethyst, and blue—the latter, being the favorite color of the German emigrant, predominating. It also made flint articles “flashed†with a thin coating of opaque white, and various articles variously bi-colored—flint and blue, blue and opaque white, and flint and amethyst. Moreover, skilled engravers and enamelers were employed, rivaling the Dutch, German, Swiss, and Bristol workmen; and enameled mugs, steins, glasses, and cordial bottles were produced, as well as engraved bottles, glasses, and flips. The aesthetic enthusiasm of the owner seems to have communicated itself to his workmen and the costlier and more decorative output of the establishment ran rapidly up a steep incline toward distinction.

As for the stylized lettering, it is written in the online Catholic Encyclopedia that toward the close of the middle ages (mid-15th century) the cross is sometimes found above the H in the IHS monogram. Here is a link to that if anyone is interested.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07649a.htm

I'll get to the bottom of this one way or another. I'll be writing the Corning Museum and sending them pictures to see what they say too.

 

[capsoda]

Is the paint baked on enamal or just painted on? the paint looks like it was laid on fairly thick and there is not to much wear on it. That could just be my PC though. It looks like there is some patina. The bottom wouldn't necessarily have a lot of wear because they were kept in a cloth lined box that was made for them.

Like Jeff said asking the pros can't hert.

 

[CanYaDigIt]

It's super thick enamel Cap Now that you mention wear on the enamel, looking very close (I'm not sure the lens on my camera can get close enough) there are very small cracks and dings in it (the enamel). It's definitely been well treated regardless of the age.

 

[appliedlips]

I don't dispute that it is blown in the form & style of an earlier bottle. I know nothing about Steigel type bottles but have handled quite a few and many times as many reproductions. Close to here, we have the largest antique mall in the country and there, one can find piles of reproduction pottery, glass, etc..It seems to be a major place of import regarding fakes and I see a good amount of " Stiegel " there, often in colors that do not fit. What I do know and have a good eye for is old glass and that just doesn't look old.. An object is what it is and in judging it, we shouldn't look for excuses for things like lack of wear,etc.. That bottom should be rubbed off of that thing by now, in addition the look of the glass just isn't right.. Show the pros and let us know

 

[kungfufighter]

Don't know if anyone will follow me on this thought but the bottles color and surface reminds me of the fantasy/reproduction German half-post case bottle with the long necks and heavy collared lips that you will sometimes see sold as "period."

Also should mention that in saying that the paint decoration was overly symmetrical I am speaking in the broader terms of Pennsylvania-German folk art in general, not simply as it relates to this bottle. The late 18th and early 19th century Germanic paint decorators were true folk artists who created works of unconstrained joy and energy without being constrained by rules or guilds. The work of this piece looks to me to too self-consciously symmetrical (almost appearing as if a template was used) to be a period piece and my belief then is that it is the result of a modern artist interpreting an earlier work rather than creating on his or her own...

 

[tigue710]

to much whittle... looks like a later mold blown bottle which isnt right for a half post molded bottle... otherwise I dont know, its a damn good reproduction...

 

[bottle_head9]

For a bottle that is 230 years old, shouldn`t there be much more highpoint wear?