Vernors Ginger Ale 150th B-Day

[iggyworf]

Good work Bob. I would like to say again that we are not trying to discredit the man. Just researching history and trying to find out the facts. We all agree that he was a great business man and propelled his Vernors Ginger Ale to great heights.

 

[hemihampton]

Reading that 1919 article it sez or sez Vernors sez he's been making his ginger ale for past 40 years. That would make it 1879. Which is similar/close to his trademark saying since about 1880. LEON.

 

[SODABOB]

Rich and Leon

Speaking of the 1919 article ...

As near as I can determine, its the first of its kind and possibly the earliest so called history ever published about James Vernor and his ginger ale. Its also possible that its the origin for all of the other histories that have ever been published.

It appeared in ...

The Bulletin of Pharmacy ~ Published by E.G. Swift, Detroit, Michigan ~ January, 1919

Here's the article in its entirety, consisting of four pages ... (Not counting the cover page)

Note: I have cropped certain paragraphs from it, that I will post shortly, and would like to discuss in more detail. So please allow me a few minutes to post the cropped portions before making additional comments. Once you see the cropped portions, I'm sure there will be a lot to discuss. Thanks!

By the way, this is possibly the first time the article has ever been posted in a savable format, so please be sure and save it to your files for easier reading.











(I'll be back momentarily with the cropped portions I'd like to discuss)

 

[SODABOB]

Notice on the first page where it says ...

"way back in 1868"

Note:

As we know, James Vernor established his first drug store in 1866 in partnership with Charles L'Hommedieu. So I'm assuming the 1868 date refers to when James Vernor ventured out on his own after dissolving the partnership with Charles L'Hommedieu. I do not believe it means to say that James Vernor established his 219 Woodward Avenue drug store in 1868.



On the first page we also find where it says ...

"$800 in 1868 to $10,000 in 1870"


Note:

This slightly contradicts the next part because it definitely uses the dates of 1868 and 1870. Whereas the next part suggest some different start dates. This is the part I think needs to be clarified and discussed the most!



Notice on page four where James Vernor Jr. says ...

"We have continued to make it the same way for over forty years"

Note:

There are a number of ways to interpret the meaning of "over forty years"

1. If, like Leon said, you take away the full forty years from when the article was published in 1919, that suggest 1879 as a start date for when James Vernor began making his ginger ale.

2. However, the actual wording says "over" forty years. So, if we allow the benefit of a doubt and use a total of forty-nine years, that places the start date at 1870. Which still falls short of the 1868 date.

3. If we use the 1919 date and take it all the way back to 1866, that comes to a total of fifty-three years.

4. But James Vernor Jr. didn't say over fifty years. He said "over forty years." So, is the "over forty" a typo or is it accurate?




(Please contemplate all of the above and we'll discuss it in detail later)

 

[SODABOB]

Follow Up / Personal Interpretation ...

We will likely never know exactly what James Vernor Jr. meant when he said "over forty years." But I'm thinking if it was forty-five years or more, that he would have said "over forty-five years" and not "over forty years." With that said, I'm thinking it was forty-four years at the most. And when you take the the 1919 date of the article and deduct forty-four years, it takes us to 1875.

Regarding the part where James Vernor Sr. said ...

"Our gross receipts in this particular department jumped from $800 in 1868 to $10,000 in 1870. The business continued on the upward trend until 1896, when I disposed of my store so that I could devote all my time to it."

... I'm not sure how to interpret that part yet, because, as I said earlier, it slightly contradicts what James Vernor Jr. was saying about it being "over forty years."

In other words ...

It appears that James Sr. and James Jr. were not on the same page when the 'interviews' were conducted and James Sr. was saying one thing and James Jr. was saying something else entirely. It appears that James Jr. was eluding to sometime in the mid 1870s, whereas James Sr. was being specific about 1868. So I really don't know what to make of it at the moment and will need more time to contemplate it.

 

[hemihampton]

I would think the over 40 years could mean 41, 42 or 43 but that's it. Because of it was 44 he would of said nearly 45 years & if 46,47 over 45 years & 48 or 49 nearly 50 years? LEON.

 

[SODABOB]

I'm okay with 42 years. Which equates to ...

1919 - 42 years = 1877

But what about James Sr's 1868 and 1870? If it was a typo for 1878 and 1880, then I wouldn't question it. Which raises the question again ...

Why is James Jr. hinting at the mid to late 1870s, but James Sr. seems to be specific about 1868 and 1870?

 

[SODABOB]

The problem with so many of the photographs we're looking at is that they have been reproduced multiple times and each time lose some of their sharpness.

The next photograph challenge is attached. It's still the James Vernor Drug Store.

However, this time it's the writing under the windows. In the early drug store photo (with smaller panes of glass) there is writing printed under each window. I'm pretty sure in a better example of this photo (attached - but let me clarify - this is NOT a better example of the photo) the green arrow would be pointing to "patent medicines". The question is what does it say by the red arrow? I'm hoping for "soda fountain", of course! "Vernor's Ginger Ale" would be even better!

It's possible I'll find a better quality example of this photo when I go to the Detroit library tomorrow.

I received my Vernor's drug store print yesterday and discovered ...

1. It does say "Patent Medicines" under the right side window. I can't make out what it says under the left side window.



2. The small sign above says ...

E.M. Wright Dental Rooms



E.M. Wright moved into 235 Woodward Avenue in ...

Detroit Free Press ~ August 13, 1872



And was located there until at least 1889, which is the latest date I can find for him at 235 Woodward Avenue

This is from a 1877 Detroit Directory under the Dental/Dentist listings ...

 

[SODABOB]

Just for the fun of it ...

 

[SODABOB]

Here are some scans of my print. I tried various resolutions but the 300 (DPI) turned out the best ...





600 (DPI) / Blurry